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 Post subject: "New Majority Agenda" SuperPAC ad, and the debt
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2012 5:28 pm 
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New anti-Obama ad
Curious that Crossroads GPS, the Karl Rove-ran organization behind the "New Majority Agenda" SuperPAC ads running, complains about skyrocketing debt and never once on its website mentions the hundreds of billions of dollars that could be saved if we dismantled Team America World Police.

Total Cost of Wars Since 2001:
$1,335,444,545,679

Cost of War in Iraq:
$803,828,476,307

Cost of War in Afghanistan:
$531,616,069,372

Comparison of military expenditures by country
Image

Policy Basics: Where Do Our Federal Tax Dollars Go?
Quote:
Defense and international security assistance: In 2011, 20 percent of the budget, or $718 billion, paid for defense and security-related international activities. The bulk of the spending in this category reflects the underlying costs of the Department of Defense and other security-related activities. The total also includes the cost of supporting operations in Iraq and Afghanistan, funding for which totaled $159 billion in 2011.

Image

The ad complains about $4 billion in debt every single day. What it never dares to mention is that half of that is thrown into the military industry. Having spent a combined year in Saudi Arabia and Iraq as a member of the Air Force and a year in Afghanistan as a DoD contractor / "war profiteer", I can tell you we're not getting great value for our money, and we're not accomplishing much at all. The only thing our military is accomplishing, all over the world, is to piss people off. But you'd never hear the "New Majority Agenda" say a single thing about that, probably because their deep-pocketed backers are the same ones actually profiting heavily off of the American global baseworld.

For anybody interested to learn just how badly we're screwing up our future financially and with respect to foreign policy, have a read of some of the excellent books on American global policy by the late Chalmers Johnson.
Blowback, Second Edition: The Costs and Consequences of American Empire
The Sorrows of Empire: Militarism, Secrecy, and the End of the Republic (The American Empire Project)
Nemesis: The Last Days of the American Republic (American Empire Project)

Whether you support the American military empire (in which case you probably don't call it an empire) or you're horrified by our largely unsuccessful 60+ years of military adventurism, you should read those books.

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 Post subject: Re: "New Majority Agenda" SuperPAC ad, and the debt
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2012 7:04 pm 
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Progurt wrote:
New anti-Obama ad
Curious that Crossroads GPS, the Karl Rove-ran organization behind the "New Majority Agenda" SuperPAC ads running, complains about skyrocketing debt and never once on its website mentions the hundreds of billions of dollars that could be saved if we dismantled Team America World Police.

Total Cost of Wars Since 2001:
$1,335,444,545,679

Cost of War in Iraq:
$803,828,476,307

Cost of War in Afghanistan:
$531,616,069,372


Comparison of military expenditures by country
Image

Policy Basics: Where Do Our Federal Tax Dollars Go?
Quote:
Defense and international security assistance: In 2011, 20 percent of the budget, or $718 billion, paid for defense and security-related international activities. The bulk of the spending in this category reflects the underlying costs of the Department of Defense and other security-related activities. The total also includes the cost of supporting operations in Iraq and Afghanistan, funding for which totaled $159 billion in 2011.

Image

The ad complains about $4 billion in debt every single day. What it never dares to mention is that half of that is thrown into the military industry. Having spent a combined year in Saudi Arabia and Iraq as a member of the Air Force and a year in Afghanistan as a DoD contractor / "war profiteer", I can tell you we're not getting great value for our money, and we're not accomplishing much at all. The only thing our military is accomplishing, all over the world, is to piss people off. But you'd never hear the "New Majority Agenda" say a single thing about that, probably because their deep-pocketed backers are the same ones actually profiting heavily off of the American global baseworld.

For anybody interested to learn just how badly we're screwing up our future financially and with respect to foreign policy, have a read of some of the excellent books on American global policy by the late Chalmers Johnson.
Blowback, Second Edition: The Costs and Consequences of American Empire
The Sorrows of Empire: Militarism, Secrecy, and the End of the Republic (The American Empire Project)
Nemesis: The Last Days of the American Republic (American Empire Project)

Whether you support the American military empire (in which case you probably don't call it an empire) or you're horrified by our largely unsuccessful 60+ years of military adventurism, you should read those books.



You cannot trust any of the information in GPS ads or anything coming out of anywhere having to do with Rove. He is the same guy who orchestrated the Swift Boat attacks on Kerry. He says that government spending is out of control under Obama when the numbers clearly show that Republican presidents have increased Federal expenditures far more than any Democratic President AND federal spending has gone up the LEAST under Obama and has tapered off.

As a progressive you can argue that it is stupid for Obama to freeze spending as we should be hiring people to fix bridges, roads, and other infrastructure so that we can get some purchasing power into the hands of the middle class and workers, but Rove's people just like to lie straight up.

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 Post subject: Re: "New Majority Agenda" SuperPAC ad, and the debt
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2012 7:10 pm 
I can't believe you post this much!
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Caliman73 wrote:
You cannot trust any of the information in GPS ads or anything coming out of anywhere having to do with Rove. He is the same guy who orchestrated the Swift Boat attacks on Kerry. He says that government spending is out of control under Obama when the numbers clearly show that Republican presidents have increased Federal expenditures far more than any Democratic President AND federal spending has gone up the LEAST under Obama and has tapered off.

As a progressive you can argue that it is stupid for Obama to freeze spending as we should be hiring people to fix bridges, roads, and other infrastructure so that we can get some purchasing power into the hands of the middle class and workers, but Rove's people just like to lie straight up.

I know who Rove is. I was pointing out the hypocrisy of Rove and his group, in ranting about the size of the debt that they inflated, and will keep inflating until they start pushing for cuts in military spending. They could end every beneficial social program overnight (which is what they're trying to do), and we would still be trillions in debt and digging deeper, because of the cost of military spending.

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 Post subject: Re: "New Majority Agenda" SuperPAC ad, and the debt
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2012 7:32 pm 
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Progurt wrote:
Caliman73 wrote:
You cannot trust any of the information in GPS ads or anything coming out of anywhere having to do with Rove. He is the same guy who orchestrated the Swift Boat attacks on Kerry. He says that government spending is out of control under Obama when the numbers clearly show that Republican presidents have increased Federal expenditures far more than any Democratic President AND federal spending has gone up the LEAST under Obama and has tapered off.

As a progressive you can argue that it is stupid for Obama to freeze spending as we should be hiring people to fix bridges, roads, and other infrastructure so that we can get some purchasing power into the hands of the middle class and workers, but Rove's people just like to lie straight up.

I know who Rove is. I was pointing out the hypocrisy of Rove and his group, in ranting about the size of the debt that they inflated, and will keep inflating until they start pushing for cuts in military spending. They could end every beneficial social program overnight (which is what they're trying to do), and we would still be trillions in debt and digging deeper, because of the cost of military spending.


It's even scarier if you look at that pie chart without the non-discretionary items, like Social Security and Medicare. It basically comes out to 58% of all the money we choose to spend goes to the military.

Image

But yeah, according to these clowns you can balance the budget on the backs of the NEA, food stamps and Planned Parenthood.

You also have to remember that under the direction of Rove and his fellow mandarins, the wars weren't even budgeted, but funded through a series emergency supplemental bills. So back then the budget numbers looked a lot better than they actually were. When the management changed, they actually had the nuts to put all that war debt on the books the way it should have been all along.

Look, we all know the issues, but how do you make wonky, numerical lists and charts of data something normal people can understand, because, make no mistake about it, we're at their mercy here. If you aren't winning them over, you aren't winning. That's what the sane people need to be working out here.

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 Post subject: Re: "New Majority Agenda" SuperPAC ad, and the debt
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2012 7:34 pm 
I can't believe you post this much!
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...I didn't think the charts and graphs supplied above were that difficult to understand or that wonky. Is it possible to dumb things down any further?

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 Post subject: Re: "New Majority Agenda" SuperPAC ad, and the debt
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2012 7:36 pm 
I can't believe you post this much!
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 Post subject: Re: "New Majority Agenda" SuperPAC ad, and the debt
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2012 7:38 pm 
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Progurt wrote:
...I didn't think the charts and graphs supplied above were that difficult to understand or that wonky. Is it possible to dumb things down any further?


It's not dumbing down, it's just saying "OK, here is the chart WITHOUT the things we are required by law to fund." It actually clarifies things because instead of making it look like your income taxes cover Social Security and Medicare (which are funding through their own payroll taxes), it shows just what we choose to spend.

You can't just govern for the commentariat, Progurt. You have to govern for everyone from the super-genius to the unsophisticated.

A lot of people are intimidated by math, or by sums of money they could never conceive of controlling, or both.

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 Post subject: Re: "New Majority Agenda" SuperPAC ad, and the debt
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2012 7:40 pm 
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Progurt wrote:
Caliman73 wrote:
You cannot trust any of the information in GPS ads or anything coming out of anywhere having to do with Rove. He is the same guy who orchestrated the Swift Boat attacks on Kerry. He says that government spending is out of control under Obama when the numbers clearly show that Republican presidents have increased Federal expenditures far more than any Democratic President AND federal spending has gone up the LEAST under Obama and has tapered off.

As a progressive you can argue that it is stupid for Obama to freeze spending as we should be hiring people to fix bridges, roads, and other infrastructure so that we can get some purchasing power into the hands of the middle class and workers, but Rove's people just like to lie straight up.

I know who Rove is. I was pointing out the hypocrisy of Rove and his group, in ranting about the size of the debt that they inflated, and will keep inflating until they start pushing for cuts in military spending. They could end every beneficial social program overnight (which is what they're trying to do), and we would still be trillions in debt and digging deeper, because of the cost of military spending.


I was agreeing with you Pro, and just adding a bit about how Rove and his ilk work to make up all of these false narratives. When I disagree with you, you'll know cause I tend to say it in the message.... :thumbup:

Have you seen the ad from Rachel Maddow on "small government"? I think it is pretty awesome. She talks about how Republicans talk about small government because they want to cut social programs and don't want government helping people, but yet they want government big enough to monitor every pregnancy in the country and force the conclusion that they want. She ends by saying something to the effect of "If you don't want government to help people, then make your case; but don't come out with this "small government stuff". Pretty simple. I am sure people who watch Fox would just tune it out.

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The American People will take Socialism, but they won't take the label. - Upton Sinclair


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 Post subject: Re: "New Majority Agenda" SuperPAC ad, and the debt
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2012 7:54 pm 
I can't believe you post this much!
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