Police shoot/kill man at Portland State University - who was trying to violence-free break up a fight.

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Damn. A case in which "a good guy with a gun" was shot and killed by police for trying to break up a fight that the police were letting happen. (He wasn't trying to use his gun, he was knocked down trying to break up the fight, and his gun fell out of his holster - when he attempted to retrieve it, the onlooking police yelled "gun" and shot him.)

https://www.opb.org/news/article/portla ... tive-leave

Note: The "good guy with a gun" was white, and protecting a black man from being attacked by a white man who had been yelling racial slurs at the black man for a while. WARNING: There is video in the linked article of the events leading right up to the shooting (no audio.)

A reminder, even being obviously the "good guy," even when the police see the whole build-up, even being white, you can still be shot and killed for carrying a gun in public. If you're carrying, be *SUPER* aware of what you do. Also, if you think you might be the kind of person to help break up a racist-fueled fight, and you carry, invest in a good-quality retention holster.

Edit: Watching the video again, I'm not 100% positive the person who was shot was truly "a good guy," he looks to have been "on the aggressor's side" early, but attempting to de-escalate. So he was apparently at least attempting to de-escalate, which is good.

Re: Police shoot/kill man at Portland State University - who was trying to violence-free break up a fight.

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That sucks that the cops killed him. Condolences to his family.


I keep mine in holster with a snap holding it in, and the holster in a closed zipper pocket of my purse. Not good for quick access, but I'm much more concerned about situations where I'd have time to get it out.
106+ recreational uses of firearms
1 defensive use
0 people injured
0 people killed

Re: Police shoot/kill man at Portland State University - who was trying to violence-free break up a fight.

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In several frames of the video you can clearly see the firearm protruding conspicuously from the right thigh pocket of the shorts. The video begins with a conspicuous zoom on the area and the carrier is also tending to his firearm with body language, keeping his right hand in a hovering posture around it wherever he isn't using that hand to drag the blue shirt guy around.

* Don't go to stupid places at stupid times with stupid friends, especially not while carrying.
* Don't play citizen cop/peacemaker while carrying, in a crowd of belligerent drunk people especially if actual cops arrive on the scene.
* Don't carry your firearm in an outside pocket with a shitty pocket holster.
* Don't drink while carrying. (Unknown whether the deceased was inebriated)

Unfortunately this person lost his life while trying to protect people and putting himself into a dangerous situation ostensibly with the intent to stop further escalation.

Also, the officers drew and fired very fast on a subject with his back turned. Hands on holsters for a few long seconds, and not unaware of the situation they were in. They should have retreated and called for backup, that scene was already pretty screwed up when they arrived.

Re: Police shoot/kill man at Portland State University - who was trying to violence-free break up a fight.

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Cops? I see one Officer...

This looked like a racist fueled fight - the guy with the pistol kept inserting himself into (between 3 people clearly starting a fight) a dangerous situation.
Is he a "Good Guy with a gun"? hard to say - need more information, it's also highly suspect that alcohol may be involved in a number of the people.
The cop should have called for backup - he's clearly outnumbered and not in control of the situation.
Having a CCW doesn't give you carte blanche.
Those who make peaceful revolution impossible, make violent revolution inevitable.

Re: Police shoot/kill man at Portland State University - who was trying to violence-free break up a fight.

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MaxwellG wrote: Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:04 am Cops? I see one Officer...

This looked like a racist fueled fight - the guy with the pistol kept inserting himself into (between 3 people clearly starting a fight) a dangerous situation.
Is he a "Good Guy with a gun"? hard to say - need more information, it's also highly suspect that alcohol may be involved in a number of the people.
The cop should have called for backup - he's clearly outnumbered and not in control of the situation.
Having a CCW doesn't give you carte blanche.
Yes, need a lot more information. It's obvious Washington has something on his waist. I know PSU is spread out, but campus police responding to a bar fight off campus? What is their mutual aid agreement with PPB? Already conflicting witness statements:
After the officers yelled that there was a gun, there was no apparent hesitation before the gunfire, the witness said. The fight started because one man used racial slurs when speaking to another man, said the witness, who provided video of the altercation leading up to the shots being fired.
"It's just a really unfortunate situation," said Donald Dietz, 25, an employee at the Cheerful Tortoise who witnessed the shooting. He had asked a co-worker to call the police when he saw a conflict inside the bar escalate and move outside. He was only a few feet away when the man was shot. "The unfortunate situation is he was trying to help and break things up," Dietz said of the man who was shot. Dietz recalled the man reaching for his gun after police told him three or four times not to.

"They warned him multiple times not to reach for it, but he did," Dietz said. "I don't want the message out there that the cops were trigger-happy." Dietz said employees at the Cheerful Tortoise did everything they could to stop the situation from escalating like it did. "It's just that people got drunk and stubborn," he added. "They had to do it," he said of the officers involved. "People think they were overzealous, but they had to do it."
Campus cops definitely out numbered. Did Washington even hear the police commands?
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: Police shoot/kill man at Portland State University - who was trying to violence-free break up a fight.

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Hasaf wrote: Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:16 pm Another reason I won't carry in a holster that lacks active retention. Yes, that is one of my take-aways.
Yup -- I'm going the same way. The only holster I'm keeping without a thumbstrap is the duty holster for my 5" N frame. That hunk of metal isn't going anywhere unless I'm turned upside down.
Image


"Person, woman, man, camera, TV."

Re: Police shoot/kill man at Portland State University - who was trying to violence-free break up a fight.

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A little background.
The Portland State University (my alma mater) security force has been authorized to carry sidearms for three years. Each are DPSST certified (Department of Public Safety Standards and Training; the state licensing organization that certifies all sworn police and fire personnel, as well as private security people and mall security guards). The distinctions for "armed security" are present however each agency has its own standards.

I work as an RO at the range where many, if not most members of local police agencies practice and drill, including DHS and Federal Police. In fact, while they are on the range or in our tactical range, I am technically their supervisor as far as gun handing and behavior in the facility is concerned. Though on the tactical range, where they can draw and fire from holsters, I stay the fuck away. (Fun Fact: We get a surprising number of ceiling strikes when these folks are gearing up for their agency qualifications! but I digress)

I have never encountered a Portland State University security guard in our facility in the three years they have been armed. They may practice and train somewhere else, but where that might be I haven't a clue. Technically PSU Security is a police force, in that they have arrest authority...however as far as members of the other area police agencies are concerned, they're untrained security guards who don't drill.

The local district attorney has taken over investigation of this travesty.
Subliterate Buffooery of the right...
Literate Ignorance of the left...
We Are So Screwed

Re: Police shoot/kill man at Portland State University - who was trying to violence-free break up a fight.

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senorgrand wrote: Mon Jul 02, 2018 4:14 pm
Hasaf wrote: Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:16 pm Another reason I won't carry in a holster that lacks active retention. Yes, that is one of my take-aways.
Yup -- I'm going the same way. The only holster I'm keeping without a thumbstrap is the duty holster for my 5" N frame. That hunk of metal isn't going anywhere unless I'm turned upside down.
I've been using Concealment Express IWB holsters. They have rubber O-Rings and a machine screw right below the trigger guard - they can be adjusted to the point that it's impossible to draw from the holster. The gun won't come out unless I really want it to.

rolandson - thanks for the background. A force that doesn't train is a scary thing, indeed! (The 'no drawing on the pistol line' rule at my local range is a result of LEOs shooting up the benches. Thanks guys! :lol: )

Re: Police shoot/kill man at Portland State University - who was trying to violence-free break up a fight.

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rolandson wrote: Mon Jul 02, 2018 8:58 pm A little background.
The Portland State University (my alma mater) security force has been authorized to carry sidearms for three years. Each are DPSST certified (Department of Public Safety Standards and Training; the state licensing organization that certifies all sworn police and fire personnel, as well as private security people and mall security guards). The distinctions for "armed security" are present however each agency has its own standards.

I work as an RO at the range where many, if not most members of local police agencies practice and drill, including DHS and Federal Police. In fact, while they are on the range or in our tactical range, I am technically their supervisor as far as gun handing and behavior in the facility is concerned. Though on the tactical range, where they can draw and fire from holsters, I stay the fuck away. (Fun Fact: We get a surprising number of ceiling strikes when these folks are gearing up for their agency qualifications! but I digress)

I have never encountered a Portland State University security guard in our facility in the three years they have been armed. They may practice and train somewhere else, but where that might be I haven't a clue. Technically PSU Security is a police force, in that they have arrest authority...however as far as members of the other area police agencies are concerned, they're untrained security guards who don't drill.

The local district attorney has taken over investigation of this travesty.
Thanks for the background, that's helpful. I automatically assume that college and university police forces are sworn peace officers because that's what we have in CA, but this is a reminder that every state is different. Have UO, OSU and WOU elected to have sworn officers or just stayed with non-sworn security guards? I assume the bar in question is off campus, is it normal for university police to respond to a call off campus? DPSST sounds like CA POST. Glad the DA has taken over the investigation, I'll be interested in reading the result.
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: Police shoot/kill man at Portland State University - who was trying to violence-free break up a fight.

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@highdesert,
I haven't a clue about the other universities in the state, though i believe that our single medical school also employs armed security...believe mind you, as i really don't know.

The PSU campus is in the southern part of what we call the "downtown" or "core" area. It's hard to say where the campus begins and the city ends. Portland is a small town; in area, the downtown portion is less than three square miles. Our 'city blocks' are about a third the size of a city block in NYC.

The bar where this happened is on a city street, in the jurisdiction of our city police, however university buildings are intermixed with privately owned buildings all over the area. Complicating matters, i believe once one is sworn as a police officer in Oregon, they have arrest authority throughout the state regardless of the city that employs them. I believe.

But...i am not certain that these guys are actually sworn. The state certification isn't the same thing. One must have DPSST certification to be sworn as a cop, but having the certification doesn't guarantee that one will get sworn. It is possible that these fellows, while being certified, were never sworn.

Put another way, from what i gather from conversations around the range, these guys do not enjoy the respect afforded brother and sister officers of neighboring agencies by the rank and file Portland cops.

All of this is leading somewhere..
The decision of the PSU trustees to arm its security force was not a popular one. Not by the students, the faculty (which occasionally includes me), many sworn Portland cops, and the community at large.
PSU is an urban university. The campus, such as it is, is, as i said, intermixed with all sorts of non-university structures, businesses, homes. And, it is approximately 30 seconds from the headquarters of the Portland Police Bureau. In short, there really isn't a campus, just a bunch of buildings spread around the south end of our main business district.

It is the hope of many, myself included, that this serves to disarm the mall guards masquerading as police officers -or- changes their mandate and requires that they meet the same qualifications of Portland cops, which are significantly greater than the state certification requirements, and then to train and drill regularly with the Portland bureau.

The shooting was captured by a number of people, the images of which are all over the web. They, the videos, are a very accurate depiction of what happened and how. In other words, the videos speak for themselves...very clearly.

Beyond that, it would be disingenuous for me to armchair quarterback...i wasn't there. I know what i think based upon the video evidence that i have seen so far. But what i think isn't suitable for public consumption. I will say that my opinion disqualifies me from serving on a jury for the hoped for criminal trial...

...but this is Portland, Oregon and the man who was killed wasn't white. I strongly doubt justice is the first word on the mind of any of those who make up the political machine that runs things around here.
Subliterate Buffooery of the right...
Literate Ignorance of the left...
We Are So Screwed

Re: Police shoot/kill man at Portland State University - who was trying to violence-free break up a fight.

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One take away from any police involved shooting is that things happen fast. Not a lot of time to have a discussion or debate whether or not to pull a gun and start shooting. The person who shoots first has a better chance of surviving. If you have your gun in hand before the other party, you have an advantage that you really want to keep.
The gun takes priority over the fight. Cops arrive in site and have no idea who the good guys are and have to react to what they see. If what they see is someone reaching for a gun , that is what they will react to. It's an immediate threat.

Google "cops hurt breaking up fights". It's safer to wait, then arrest the winner.
Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on or one day we will spend our sunset years telling our children what it was once like in the United States where men were free.
- Ronald Reagan

Re: Police shoot/kill man at Portland State University - who was trying to violence-free break up a fight.

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Thank you, Rolandson! Excellent thoughts on the matter and background information. Far more than what we can get from the news.
"It is better to be violent, if there is violence in our hearts, than to put on the cloak of non-violence to cover impotence. There is hope for a violent man to become non-violent. There is no such hope for the impotent." -Gandhi

Re: Police shoot/kill man at Portland State University - who was trying to violence-free break up a fight.

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rolandson wrote: Tue Jul 03, 2018 3:12 am @highdesert,
I haven't a clue about the other universities in the state, though i believe that our single medical school also employs armed security...believe mind you, as i really don't know.

The PSU campus is in the southern part of what we call the "downtown" or "core" area. It's hard to say where the campus begins and the city ends. Portland is a small town; in area, the downtown portion is less than three square miles. Our 'city blocks' are about a third the size of a city block in NYC.

The bar where this happened is on a city street, in the jurisdiction of our city police, however university buildings are intermixed with privately owned buildings all over the area. Complicating matters, i believe once one is sworn as a police officer in Oregon, they have arrest authority throughout the state regardless of the city that employs them. I believe.

But...i am not certain that these guys are actually sworn. The state certification isn't the same thing. One must have DPSST certification to be sworn as a cop, but having the certification doesn't guarantee that one will get sworn. It is possible that these fellows, while being certified, were never sworn.

Put another way, from what i gather from conversations around the range, these guys do not enjoy the respect afforded brother and sister officers of neighboring agencies by the rank and file Portland cops.

All of this is leading somewhere..
The decision of the PSU trustees to arm its security force was not a popular one. Not by the students, the faculty (which occasionally includes me), many sworn Portland cops, and the community at large.
PSU is an urban university. The campus, such as it is, is, as i said, intermixed with all sorts of non-university structures, businesses, homes. And, it is approximately 30 seconds from the headquarters of the Portland Police Bureau. In short, there really isn't a campus, just a bunch of buildings spread around the south end of our main business district.

It is the hope of many, myself included, that this serves to disarm the mall guards masquerading as police officers -or- changes their mandate and requires that they meet the same qualifications of Portland cops, which are significantly greater than the state certification requirements, and then to train and drill regularly with the Portland bureau.

The shooting was captured by a number of people, the images of which are all over the web. They, the videos, are a very accurate depiction of what happened and how. In other words, the videos speak for themselves...very clearly.

Beyond that, it would be disingenuous for me to armchair quarterback...i wasn't there. I know what i think based upon the video evidence that i have seen so far. But what i think isn't suitable for public consumption. I will say that my opinion disqualifies me from serving on a jury for the hoped for criminal trial...

...but this is Portland, Oregon and the man who was killed wasn't white. I strongly doubt justice is the first word on the mind of any of those who make up the political machine that runs things around here.
PSU is like many urban universities and colleges, they grew and expanded after the city built up so it doesn't have a well defined campus. Another reason for them to closely train and respond with Portland police or only take a secondary role in off campus situations. PSU administrators along with the trustees will have some decisions to make once they have the results from the internal and DA investigations the university and by extension the state have liability issues. Perhaps this needs to get bumped up to the state level. In CA there is one board of regents for the 10 UC campuses and one board of trustees for the 23 CSU campuses so there is more consistency in an area like campus police forces.

I agree, there is plenty of video and hopefully it captured it from different angles along with physical evidence and your police use of force laws in OR.

I appreciate your input.
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: Police shoot/kill man at Portland State University - who was trying to violence-free break up a fight.

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David O’Bryant has done a lot of things in his life to protect himself. He’s studied self-defense. He’s taken time to learn about white supremacist groups that operate in Oregon. And he bought a gun. “I do think that it behooves marginalized communities to at least explore the possibilities of firearms for self-defense,” O’Bryant said. O’Bryant is among many people reflecting on the complex interplay of firearm ownership and the realities of being black in Oregon, following the shooting death of Jason Washington in June.

Washington was a Navy veteran, a grandfather and licensed to carry a concealed handgun. He was shot and killed by Portland State University campus police in the early morning hours of June 29. Investigators have said little since the incident, but witnesses said Washington was attempting to break up a fight when his handgun fell out of its holster. Video of the shooting shows Washington attempt to retrieve the firearm, someone shouting “gun,” and then police opening fire. According to the Washington Post’s “Fatal Force Project,” police have killed at least 110 black people in America in 2018, as of early July. But Washington’s death doesn’t fit neatly into the national discussion of unarmed black men being gunned down by police. By Andre Washington’s account, his brother Jason was a supporter of the Second Amendment, social issues and “perhaps the most ironic of them all is [he] supported the police.”

“When there’s this demand for public safety, like having armed officers on PSU’s campus in the first place, mixed with an underlying culture that allows implicit anti-blackness to create a perception of black men as a threat, it results in this kind of thing,” O’Bryant said, “even when you have … somebody who has a concealed carry license ostensibly to defend themselves and others around them.” O’Bryant, a PSU graduate himself, said he thought about the risks that come along with being black and carrying a gun in Oregon before he ever bought a weapon. Washington’s death hasn’t changed how he feels. “There’s definitely a component of risk that could be read into being armed and black. However, that risk doesn’t disappear because you are unarmed,” he said. “That risk is present because you are living in a culture that promotes anti-black bias.”

Who Is Buying Guns

The reasons Oregonians buy guns can vary significantly, from personal protection to hunting, target shooting and collecting. Regardless of the reason, statistics show gun ownership in the state climbing significantly over the past decade. According to the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms, the number of weapons in Oregon registered under the National Firearms Act nearly doubled in the last eight years — from 35,718 in 2010 to 66,346 in early 2018. Justin Davis is among those Oregonians who bought a gun in that time period. “It’s just fun to go around and target shoot — and to know that if I had to be put in a spot where I had to defend my family, I could,” he said. Davis is black and lives in Lake County, one of Oregon’s most sparsely populated areas. He said he’s conscious of his race and the danger that potentially creates in rural Oregon, an area that is even more overwhelmingly white than the state as a whole. Still, Davis said his race isn’t the reason he owns a gun.

“I don’t think I needed to buy a gun to protect myself from (racists),” Davis said, adding that he would always focus on de-escalation before turning to a firearm. “The last thing you should want to do is shoot somebody. I own guns, and that’s the last thing I want to do.” It’s not clear how many African-American Oregonians own guns because the state does not release demographic data on gun ownership due to privacy laws. But a 2017 survey by the Pew Research Foundation showed a third of black households in America do have a gun. For whites, that number is closer to 50 percent. Gun rights groups for people of color have also seen significant growth in recent years alongside the emboldening of hate groups, such as those that marched at the infamous “Unite the Right” rally in Charlottesville, Virginia. NPR reports that the National African American Gun Association’s membership tripled after the inauguration of President Trump. For Davis, Washington’s death at the hands of police and the question of whether his race played a factor is unsettling. “The fact that people feel the need to interview African American gun owners in 2018, it creates a bad feeling in my stomach,” Davis said. “I had kind of thought we’d be further than this at this point.”

Second Amendment For All

Washington’s death, much like the 2016 shooting of Philando Castile by a Minnesota police officer, highlights a rift within the gun rights community over issues of race and officer-involved shootings. The National Rifle Association faced criticism from some of its members after Castile’s death because it did not speak out strongly in support of Castile, who legally owned a firearm and was shot by a police officer after he told the officer the handgun was in the car. While NRA spokeswoman Dana Loesch called Castile’s death a “terrible tragedy that could have been avoided,” she also questioned his right to carry the gun because of a small amount of cannabis in his car at the time of the shooting.

“Carrying firearm w controlled substance is not ‘lawful carry.’ Important,” Loesch said to her critics on Twitter. Similarly, Loesch said Washington bore responsibility for his death. In an interview on NRA TV with California attorney Chuck Michel, Loesch said Washington should have backed away from the situation. “When police are already there on scene, I think you have to question do you need to be involved anymore at that point?” she asked. Michel agreed with the sentiment. “You can’t assume the police won’t see you as a threat,” he said. “Let them deal with it. I mean, I hate to blame it on Washington, but he is not blameless in this situation.” Both Loesch and Michel are white.

But some black Oregonians agree with the notion that police made the right call during the PSU incident. “If you drop your weapon in the presence of an officer of the law, you should probably back away, because they’re the only ones that can really fire a firearm at that point,” said Donny Adair, a Portlander who regularly takes African Americans out to teach them how to hunt game. Portland Police are still investigating Washington’s shooting and have not released any information, so it’s unclear exactly what happened in the moments before the death. Adair said the same basic rules apply to anyone who decides to carry a concealed weapon, regardless of race.

“Maybe he was trying to keep someone else from getting it or something like that. But it’s hard for me to say that this is anything but an unfortunate circumstance,” Adair said. The Oregon Firearms Federation, a political advocacy group, did not issue an official statement after Washington’s death. But the rift in the guns community over race and concealed handgun licenses did play out on the group’s Facebook page after it posted a link to a news story on the shooting with the caption “Not good.” “Cop needs to lose his job. Very sad,” one user wrote.

“Great. Now we will hear how racist everyone is,” wrote another. The Talk Isaac Fearn’s father taught him how to handle a gun when he was 8. But he didn’t get into gun culture until after he joined the Marines in 2011. Fearn said shortly after he returned from deployment to his wife and newborn son, someone attempted to break into their home. He decided to buy a shotgun as a “budget” security system. “After that, I actually built my first AR,” Fearn said, who now has a firearms instructor certification and teaches people gun safety.

Fearn, who wore a T-shirt adorned with the image of an AR-15 and the words “Come and Take It” during an interview, said he’s disappointed that the NRA and other gun organizations don’t do more to support people of color who use their Second Amendment rights.“It’s like, ‘We are here trying to support you guys as well, why don’t we get the same support back?’” Fearn said. “It is our constitutional right to keep and bear arms.” He said lobbying organizations such as the NRA spend an inordinate amount of time focused on political battles with the left, instead of working on solutions to prevent loss of life.

“We need to sit down and talk about it versus the right and the left fighting each other about it,” Fearn said. To prevent another death like Washington or Castile, Fearn said he’d like to see training for police officers that emphasizes de-escalation and conflict resolution. Weapon use, he said, should be a last resort tactic. “I’ve always had a friendly interaction with [police officers],” Fearn said, “but as far as the whole racial bias thing, I believe it’s there. I really do.” Even after the PSU incident, Fearn said he still believes in more people of color owning guns for their own protection and having armed guards on school campuses to protect against mass shootings. He plans to take his son, now 3, shooting someday.

But he also plans to have “the talk” on how to handle encounters with police. “As far as dealing with the police, don’t have your hands by your side. Hold your hands by your chest, indicating you’re not reaching for anything,” Fearn said without pause. It’s a conversation had countless times across the country. Gun ownership just adds another dimension to it. “It’s going to be a tough conversation to have with him,” Fearn said, “but at the same time, he does need to be aware that you are a person of color in today’s America, right now.”
https://www.opb.org/news/article/portla ... amendment/
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: Police shoot/kill man at Portland State University - who was trying to violence-free break up a fight.

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A grand jury in Oregon has found that two campus security officers at Portland State University were acting in self-defense when they fatally shot a black man outside a bar.

Multnomah County prosecutors said Thursday that the grand jury found PSU officers James Dewey and Shawn McKenzie should not face criminal charges. Jason Washington, a 45-year-old Navy veteran, was killed in the June 29 incident in downtown Portland. A witness who captured on video the moments leading up to the shooting says Washington was trying to break up a fight when a gun fell out of his pocket. He was shot seconds later after someone shouted, "Gun!"

Washington had a valid license to carry a concealed weapon. The shooting renewed protests over the university's 2015 decision to arm its police.
http://www.kezi.com/content/news/Grand- ... 97691.html
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: Police shoot/kill man at Portland State University - who was trying to violence-free break up a fight.

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Ah fer crissakes... a jury of your peers for a shooting in Portland OR would have to consist of LGC members to get a fair hearing.
"It is better to be violent, if there is violence in our hearts, than to put on the cloak of non-violence to cover impotence. There is hope for a violent man to become non-violent. There is no such hope for the impotent." -Gandhi

Re: Police shoot/kill man at Portland State University - who was trying to violence-free break up a fight.

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Bisbee wrote: Fri Sep 14, 2018 7:12 pm Ah fer crissakes... a jury of your peers for a shooting in Portland OR would have to consist of LGC members to get a fair hearing.

That’s the truth. To many Portlanders just having a gun makes you guilty.

Police body cam video:


The guy was:

1) In a bar while armed (legal but shows poor judgment)
2) Kept inserting himself into the fight to break it up (very Boy Scout of him, but again poor judgment... he was not a cop)
3) Was not in fact concealed carrying...used a dumbass Clipdraw slide clip that made his pistol clearly visible...
5D9C1445-9824-48C7-9065-A62ABD28C153.jpeg
4E1F25CA-52E4-49F0-A0C3-E12B057B722B.png
When Campus Police pulled up a bystander pointed to Washington and said “that guy pulled a gun on us” ..something sure
to immediately raise the threat level in a cop’s mind right off the bat.
Then he tried to (instinctively?) grab the gun when it fell out.... (that’s your “shoot me” signal right there from a cop’s view)
It was a sad, unfortunate, incident, but the police were justified in shooting. The jury agreed.

By the way, I’ve been in that bar —a local landmark— and have stood on that exact spot many times. This hits home.
Image
Image

Re: Police shoot/kill man at Portland State University - who was trying to violence-free break up a fight.

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Another case of, "Play dumb games, win stupid prizes?"

That clip is meant to carry the pistol OUTSIDE the pocket? WTF?!? How is that even remotely secure? Every such clip I've seen have been mounted reversed and meant for CC inside the pocket...
"It is better to be violent, if there is violence in our hearts, than to put on the cloak of non-violence to cover impotence. There is hope for a violent man to become non-violent. There is no such hope for the impotent." -Gandhi

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