Long distance marksmanship training

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This last month, the Frisco Gun Club has started offering "sniper" classes, really it's long distance marksmanship from a group that offers paramilitary/law enforcement/military style marksmanship training.

It's $800 for a two day course. First day on one weekend is classroom, then on another weekend it's range practice.

Being the contrary person I am, the only scoped rifle I own is a Mosin Nagant 91/30 PU sniper. While I would enjoy and benefit from the instruction and practice, I hesitate, because I know that the people who will show up will be armed with modern rifles and high power fancy scopes.

My PU scope is only 3.5 power. And there are no click adjustments, the elevation and windage turrets operate by friction. So I am inquiring here for a consensus. Should I go and and call the others Wussies for not using a truly manly rifle and scope, proven in battle? Or should I be meeker and just attempt to shame them with my natural accomplishments using tecnologically inferior and outclassed 70 year old equipment.
If you want to be a leader, lead from the front, and don't look back.

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Re: Long distance marksmanship training

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eelj wrote:What could they possibly teach you in 2 days that would justify the 800 buck fee?
Getting to shoot out to 1000 yards. Very few ranges go past 200 yards around here.

And the possibility that I might get some personal observation comments on my shooting technique by someone experienced on long range marksmanship.
If you want to be a leader, lead from the front, and don't look back.

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Re: Long distance marksmanship training

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sturner wrote:
eelj wrote:What could they possibly teach you in 2 days that would justify the 800 buck fee?
Getting to shoot out to 1000 yards. Very few ranges go past 200 yards around here.

And the possibility that I might get some personal observation comments on my shooting technique by someone experienced on long range marksmanship.
Head south a couple of hours. Best of the West has a 1000 yard range that's $10/day after you qualify to shoot that far.

http://www.texasshootingrange.com/ameni ... ange-fees/
LGC Texas - Vice President

Re: Long distance marksmanship training

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Just a point of note though, if you haven't taken an Appleseed yet, that would be well worth your time first. The principles taught there are absolutely applicable. And you're only out $25.

Where the long range class should come in, I think, is bullet drop compensation, windage, and the other whole host of stuff that goes into reaching out that far, and not taking 20 shots to walk it in. Where the equipment struggle may be is in the adjustments to get on target.
“Do the best you can until you know better. Then when you know better, do better.”
- Maya Angelou

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Re: Long distance marksmanship training

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Simmer down wrote:
atxgunguy wrote: Head south a couple of hours. Best of the West has a 1000 yard range that's $10/day after you qualify to shoot that far.

http://www.texasshootingrange.com/ameni ... ange-fees/
Ten is closer to my budget. I wouldn't be able to concentrate if I had to pay more than that.

What does Qualify to Shoot involve?
Not sure about that...my guess is that you have to prove:

a) Your weapon is capable of hitting a target that far out
b) YOU are capable of hitting a target that far out

The Range Officers out there are decent folk, so it would probably just a matter of telling the front desk what you want to do and have an RO confirm it.

...as for the range itself. It's nice, pretty much dug out of a big acreage of limestone with berms and such dividing out the pistol/rifle/shotgun/tactical sections. The ricochet noise from people rapid-fire shooting steel is a bit disconcerting, but I've never run into any safety concerns.
LGC Texas - Vice President

Re: Long distance marksmanship training

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There is a range I go to which has a 1000yd class. The only requirement is that your rifle can do 1moa. Everything else is user dependent.

How good do you shoot at 300yd? Or 100? Or even 25 against the 1" square targets? Personally I would not bother with 1000yd until I feel I learned everything I could at the smaller distances.

FYI, I did the 300yd class at that range, and found out that with my non-American gas-operated battle rifle with a $25 scope and cheapest ammo (Wally World) I could get, I was keeping up with the Big Boys with Remington 700s and ARs with bull barrels and muzzle breaks and $1000 scopes and handloads. My grouping was 8" at 300yd and I honestly think that is more my fault than the rifle; if I take the time and put the effort to practice what I learned (trigger, breathing, etc) there, I can shrink that. If I can bring it to 4-3", I will consider taking the 1000yd class offered in that range ($250, not $800) so to learn about The Way of the Wind and Gravity.

Appleseed is humbling in a very good way IMHO. I heard of people who had been shooting for millenia and said they learned a lot there; they do require a learning attitude. Reding your other posts, it seems you are way past that, so once again how are your groupings?

Re: Long distance marksmanship training

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Howdy! I know this thread is a few days stale but my long range gun is a MN91/30 with full length free floated barrel, Monte Carlo stock and 6-12x38mm scope. I'll get pics this weekend and my intro post in the noob section explains that whole deal.

I've hit the a limit at 600 with mine. I've experimented with lots of different ammo the best I've found for distance is 203gr FMJ Silver Bear. I had some 201gr match grade hand loads with brass cases, but the Silver Bear flies just as straight and brass cases stuck in the chamber. My bolt handle is turned down to clear the scope, so getting the leverage to pull up and back was a hassle in the prone.

Best 10 shot group to date is 5" at 600m with one outlier. At 650 ballistics goes nuts, I don't know if it's screwballing or tumbling but it goes all over, high-left one shot, low-right the next and I mean by feet, not inches. this is just my experience and I'm sure somebody here has done better and if so, I hope to read how so I can improve my distance!

If you take that class let us know how it went and what you learned! :beer2:

EDIT>>> To add: With my setup and ammo 0 at 50m puts you damn near 0 at 300m adjusting only for windage, at 150m it's about 4cm high. Out to 600 it's just windage and drop. I know nothing about adjusting for Coriolis effect, curvature of the earth or any of that other cool stuff Marky Mark said in Shooter. :D I'm not in competition or planning for SHTF, I just like shooting for distance with this gun.
"Never trust a big butt & a smile." -A.I.M. Scientist Supreme

Re: Long distance marksmanship training

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With a 3.5x power scope at 1000 yards you'll need some damn good eyes. Since you indicated you generally shoot open sights, I'm guessing you have them. I know I can't shoot accurately at that distance without a high-magnification scope. But my old eyes really suck.

If you can pull it off, it might be worth $800 to show up the super-sniper wannabes with their high-tech, high-dollar gear. Afterwards you can tell them you belong to the Liberal Gun Club. :laugh:
I've seen all good people turn their heads each day
so satisfied I'm on my way

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