So, I'm still at the musing stage on this, but would appreciate some smart people's feed back. Being less so myself, it is unclear how well I'll follow that advice.
I have some fun toys. I don't rally have a good steel ringing rifle. Sort of - I have a pre ban safe queen that occasionally goes out, but I'd like something that's not going to be as subject to scrutiny. I can barely squeeze one more rifle into the safe, and I think this will be the slot I want to fill.
Here's what I think I want - feel free to make arguments in favor or against:
- Semi auto.
- A caliber I already own.
- No bullet button
- Supports (military style) iron sights
- Happily hit steel at 600 yards
Things I think that might work:
Ares SCR if it ever comes out.
Fancy AR build with a hammerhead grip and stuff
or, the pricey option: M1A
Re: Help me pick a rifle!
2What calibers do you already have that can reach that distance?
If you already have an AR, buy the hammerhead and try it before building a whole new rifle around it...it's weird.
If you already have an AR, buy the hammerhead and try it before building a whole new rifle around it...it's weird.
Re: Help me pick a rifle!
3I know you said a chambering you already have but your requirements scream M1 Garand to me.
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Re: Help me pick a rifle!
4What calibers do you already have?
I forget, are you a tinkerer? If so, there are things you can do to up the accuracy of a Mini-14. They are cool little guns.
I adore my M1A. I also think Garands are equally great rifles. I see the choice like this: you pay more for a caliber with better availability and a removable box magazine. Otherwise, they are the same great rifle. If I hadn't run in to my oddball M1A, I probably would have bought the Garand. It's the machine that goes PING!
I forget, are you a tinkerer? If so, there are things you can do to up the accuracy of a Mini-14. They are cool little guns.
I adore my M1A. I also think Garands are equally great rifles. I see the choice like this: you pay more for a caliber with better availability and a removable box magazine. Otherwise, they are the same great rifle. If I hadn't run in to my oddball M1A, I probably would have bought the Garand. It's the machine that goes PING!
Re: Help me pick a rifle!
5couple of years ago i let an M1A with some kind of huge leupold scope for $1500 slip through my fingers, and have been kicking myself since.
i'm retired. what's your excuse?
Re: Help me pick a rifle!
6Whell, if I ain't a dummy for not thinking of that. Somehow My brain was insisting that I had to try it on the gun it would eventually go on.try it
Aside from the calibers (from the list below, basically 5.56 or .308), I think Garand makes sense to. What are the fundamental differences between a Garand, and the M1A aside from caliber? And how much better are the ballistics of '06 vs 308?
Re: Help me pick a rifle!
8The CMP Special is offered in .308 if you don't want to expand your range of ammo:
http://www.odcmp.com/Sales/m1garand.htm#Special
-Bill
http://www.odcmp.com/Sales/m1garand.htm#Special
-Bill
Re: Help me pick a rifle!
9Are you planning to scope this rifle?
I love shooting the M1 Garand, but I recently got an M1A because it has reasonable scope options and the Garand really doesn't.
If you go the featureless AR route, consider the Thordsen Custom FRS-15 stock as an alternative the the hammerhead.
http://www.thordsencustoms.com/frs-15-stock.htm
I like it. More like a traditional rifle stock.
I love shooting the M1 Garand, but I recently got an M1A because it has reasonable scope options and the Garand really doesn't.
If you go the featureless AR route, consider the Thordsen Custom FRS-15 stock as an alternative the the hammerhead.
http://www.thordsencustoms.com/frs-15-stock.htm
I like it. More like a traditional rifle stock.
"To initiate a war of aggression...is the supreme international crime" - Nuremberg prosecutor Robert Jackson, 1946
Re: Help me pick a rifle!
10I'd like to be able to scope it, though I'd probably mainly shoot with the irons. I just found the 308 Garand option - that's mighty tempting.
It's probably sacrilegious that I enjoy it when other people ping, but I get no real pleasure out of doing it myself.
I'm sure the Thorsden stock would feel great, but looking at it makes me cry. Not rational, I know, but I don't have to be.
It's probably sacrilegious that I enjoy it when other people ping, but I get no real pleasure out of doing it myself.
I'm sure the Thorsden stock would feel great, but looking at it makes me cry. Not rational, I know, but I don't have to be.
Re: Help me pick a rifle!
11If you're considering a .308 Garand, I'd only get one from CMP. There are Navy Garands in .308 out there that were really lousy conversions with sleeved chambers.
The rifles are pretty much the same beyond style, magazine, scope mounting, and caliber. The difference between .30-06 and .308 is pretty much zero in the military style loadings that function properly in these rifles. If I had to carry one, I'd go M1A. At the range, I'd probably go Garand, even though I didn't.
I have a bolt gun for scope shooting. One of the things I like about these rifles is the amazing quality of the iron sights.
The rifles are pretty much the same beyond style, magazine, scope mounting, and caliber. The difference between .30-06 and .308 is pretty much zero in the military style loadings that function properly in these rifles. If I had to carry one, I'd go M1A. At the range, I'd probably go Garand, even though I didn't.
I have a bolt gun for scope shooting. One of the things I like about these rifles is the amazing quality of the iron sights.
Re: Help me pick a rifle!
12How much do you want to spend? There's that.
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Re: Help me pick a rifle!
13+1 for a Garand. And if you don't like it I'll buy it off you.wlewisiii wrote:I know you said a chambering you already have but your requirements scream M1 Garand to me.
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Re: Help me pick a rifle!
14What do you have in 308 already? As a point of note, I did see an SVT-40 at a local shop. I think it would probably do the trick, and it's an interesting old beast. And 7.62x54 is cheap still. But if you want something that just works, is easily scoped, and can reach way out there, AR-10 with a bullet button perhaps?
That all said, I do love the feel and look of the M1A. Easily scoped as well, and feels great. I'd pick that over the AR-10 in a heartbeat. Only because of form, not because of function.
I already have a Garand. Something everyone should own IMO. But if the ping doesn't do it for you, there's some cool options to be had.
That all said, I do love the feel and look of the M1A. Easily scoped as well, and feels great. I'd pick that over the AR-10 in a heartbeat. Only because of form, not because of function.
I already have a Garand. Something everyone should own IMO. But if the ping doesn't do it for you, there's some cool options to be had.
Re: Help me pick a rifle!
15A Kimber 84M. Delightful rifle, but because of its skinny skinny barrel, it starts losing accuracy after the first 4 shots and you have to let it cool off. Great for hunting, not so great for throwing a lot of lead down a range.What do you have in 308
I really hate the idea of the bullet button. Someone suggested a Raddlock, I'm not fond of that either. I'm also okay with a traditional stock.
This is all making me lean to an M1A. The upside is that it'll be even more incentive to start reloading.
Given my predilection for carbines, is there any reason not to get the Scout model?
I'm at least a couple of months away from this, BTW. I'm just dream shopping in my head.
Re: Help me pick a rifle!
16I think the scout and the socom lean more towards being attempts at guns that would be better in smaller calibers.
Another consideration between m1a and Garand is the question of shooting in the standing position. Mag in your palm or less support holding the forend. Unless you happen to have a pre-ban m14 mag, note that the CA 10 rounders are a little short for my preference as a hand rest. Fortunately, I think I remember you having a few of those sitting around.
Another consideration between m1a and Garand is the question of shooting in the standing position. Mag in your palm or less support holding the forend. Unless you happen to have a pre-ban m14 mag, note that the CA 10 rounders are a little short for my preference as a hand rest. Fortunately, I think I remember you having a few of those sitting around.
Re: Help me pick a rifle!
17No m14 mags. just AR 30 rounders.
Hmm. This has been great advice - I'ma let it marinate for a while.
Hmm. This has been great advice - I'ma let it marinate for a while.
Re: Help me pick a rifle!
18Good lord, that thing looks like my crutches!Elmo wrote:Are you planning to scope this rifle?
I love shooting the M1 Garand, but I recently got an M1A because it has reasonable scope options and the Garand really doesn't.
If you go the featureless AR route, consider the Thordsen Custom FRS-15 stock as an alternative the the hammerhead.
http://www.thordsencustoms.com/frs-15-stock.htm
I like it. More like a traditional rifle stock.
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Re: Help me pick a rifle!
19If you want to be different, the Winchester 100 is a fun gun. And the Remington 7615 takes AR mags.
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Re: Help me pick a rifle!
20I went with a M1A Scout Squad. It is essentially a standard M1A with 4" chopped off the barrel (18" instead of 22"), but with all parts still interchangeable with a standard M1A/M14.
You want the extra 4" if you are shooting with the iron sights (longer sight radius). If you are scoped, from what I have read, the longer barrel doesn't add any accuracy. And I thought the shorter rifle would be more maneuverable in 3-gun, which is my intended use for it.
The Socom, with its 16" barrel, is a very different beast, however. Apparently it has a number of nonstandard parts around the gas system, etc. That's a price I didn't want to pay for an additional 2" of shortening. (Plus, the Socom doesn't look "right" to me -- sort of like the Garand "Tanker" -- just out of proportion. I'm sure some feel that way about the Scout Squad as well, but I'm cool with it.)
Personal preference, plus intended application.
You want the extra 4" if you are shooting with the iron sights (longer sight radius). If you are scoped, from what I have read, the longer barrel doesn't add any accuracy. And I thought the shorter rifle would be more maneuverable in 3-gun, which is my intended use for it.
The Socom, with its 16" barrel, is a very different beast, however. Apparently it has a number of nonstandard parts around the gas system, etc. That's a price I didn't want to pay for an additional 2" of shortening. (Plus, the Socom doesn't look "right" to me -- sort of like the Garand "Tanker" -- just out of proportion. I'm sure some feel that way about the Scout Squad as well, but I'm cool with it.)
Personal preference, plus intended application.
"To initiate a war of aggression...is the supreme international crime" - Nuremberg prosecutor Robert Jackson, 1946
Re: Help me pick a rifle!
21CZ 550 Varmit heavy barrel in .308. You can find them for about $750.
Ruger M77 Target in .308 for about $725.
Howa heavy barrel Varminter with scope for about $575. (cheap scope but it might do)
The Savage 10P for about $525.
Or you can go whole hog with the CZ750 sniper with 10 round mag and guaranteed MOA accuracy to 800 yards for $2k.
Frankly I'd get the Savage and go find a $500 scope for it.
Ruger M77 Target in .308 for about $725.
Howa heavy barrel Varminter with scope for about $575. (cheap scope but it might do)
The Savage 10P for about $525.
Or you can go whole hog with the CZ750 sniper with 10 round mag and guaranteed MOA accuracy to 800 yards for $2k.
Frankly I'd get the Savage and go find a $500 scope for it.
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I carry due to toxic masculinity.......just other people's.
I carry due to toxic masculinity.......just other people's.
Re: Help me pick a rifle!
22Springfield Scout Squad if you want to go .308 (The Sage EBR stock looks great on these). Mini-14 is another one to check out. You might want to look for a Keltec SU-16, some folks like those.