Is Civil War Coming?

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Will there be a Civil War 2.0?

Yes. Some kind of violence breaking out between Reds and Blues is likely.
11
46%
No. America is better than that. Stop being so bloody paranoid.
4
17%
I dunno. I sure hope not. Talking things over reasonably is the answer. Can’t we all just get along and compromise?
9
38%
 
Total votes: 24

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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#26 Post by Bardo » Wed Oct 10, 2018 8:21 am

Whats more interesting is how would it be fought? Guerilla style? Trench? Marching through old farms with pack 4 wheelers and 50lb overweight 40-50 somethings carrying ar15's?

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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#27 Post by HuckleberryFun » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:18 am

Bardo wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 8:21 am
Whats more interesting is how would it be fought? Guerilla style? Trench? Marching through old farms with pack 4 wheelers and 50lb overweight 40-50 somethings carrying ar15's?
If it comes to that it won’t matter to you. You’ll be dead. Some 50 pound overweight forty-something militia goon will have put the muzzle of his AR to the back of your head, pulled the trigger, and buried you in a mass grave in that old farm trench. Maybe you can dissuade him by reasonably talking things over, finding middle ground and compromising. Good luck.

As I said in my OP, I don’t believe that anything like this is imminent, but it is within the realm of possibility now especially if things keep devolving. I see that many on here don’t accept that possibility. We’ll talk about it again in a few years when things become clearer for you. In the meantime I hear there is a sale on gluten free bread at Whole Foods... go pick some up before your next protest march or hot tub party.

If this country doesn’t get its shit together I see two main paths. Either we will continue the long, slow, decline that we’ve been on for over a generation now and end up a dysfunctional near-failed kleptocratic state like Nigeria (for example) in which things barely hold together, or we will simply collapse of our own weight like the Soviet Union did with head-spinning rapidity. Either could happen, or neither.

I just want things to hold together long enough so I can enjoy a nice quiet life. Don’t fuck it up for me, ok people?
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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#28 Post by CDFingers » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:27 am

As long as six packs can be bought and sportsball can be seen any time on TV, there will be no uprising among the simmering frogs. It is the nature of decaying empires to have many embroiled in ennui and substance abuse while change happens beneath the waves.

Demographics, folks. Keep your heads down, but it will work out in a messy and interesting fashion. The Deep State is the Constitution.

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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#29 Post by HuckleberryFun » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:51 am

CDFingers wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:27 am
As long as six packs can be bought and sportsball can be seen any time on TV, there will be no uprising among the simmering frogs. It is the nature of decaying empires to have many embroiled in ennui and substance abuse while change happens beneath the waves.

Demographics, folks. Keep your heads down, but it will work out in a messy and interesting fashion. The Deep State is the Constitution.

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The rabbis of Europe told their flocks to keep their heads down: this whole Hitler thing will blow over. Things will work out.
Let’s hope your similar faith in demographics and the “Deep State” to save us is not misplaced.

A common theme of Nazi propaganda in WWII was that Americans are too soft, too degenerate, and too distracted by shallow consumer culture to be able or willing to fight well. The Confederates thought the same about soft and pasty city dwelling Northerners. The first step to losing a war is underestimating your enemy.
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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#30 Post by AndyH » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:16 pm

I still think the poll is funny. Is a civil war coming? It's already in progress and so far we're losing politically, we're losing media as they move right, and there's already about 40 dead.
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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#31 Post by CDFingers » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:21 pm

Sure, those two sets of conditions are equal. Not.

The premise that a war exists is false. Keyboard cowboys strive to make it seem as if there's a war, but fewer than 1/4 of folks actually actively think about that. Might see a few lone wolfs, as mentioned above, but there aren't enough like minded folks to make a civil war.

There will be, however, lots of old frightened white folks with larger stacks of ammo in their closets.

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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#32 Post by featureless » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:24 pm

AndyH wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:16 pm
I still think the poll is funny. Is a civil war coming? It's already in progress and so far we're losing politically, we're losing media as they move right, and there's already about 40 dead.
Funny thing is, the repugs think the libruls control the media.

I've become suspicious of all media as the rush to publish has resulted in a "damn the facts" and "sensation over substance" methodology. Always looking for source materials these days...

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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#33 Post by AndyH » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:39 pm

CDFingers wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:21 pm
Sure, those two sets of conditions are equal. Not.

The premise that a war exists is false. Keyboard cowboys strive to make it seem as if there's a war, but fewer than 1/4 of folks actually actively think about that. Might see a few lone wolfs, as mentioned above, but there aren't enough like minded folks to make a civil war.

There will be, however, lots of old frightened white folks with larger stacks of ammo in their closets.

CDFingers
Keyboard cowboys? Absolutely! Ammo hoarders? Yup. Fewer than 1/4 of folks think about that? OK, I'll go with that.

If one's definition of 'war' consists simply as two lines of soldiers with rifles pointed at each other in a field outside Gettysburg, then I'll agree that we're not in a full shooting war yet. However - recall the cold war. Consider information warfare and guerrilla tactics. It's a mistake to isolate the various physical attacks from the rest of the process. The keyboard cowboys are coming out of their basements and they're executing their plan...and liberals.

https://www.splcenter.org/20180205/alt- ... ing-people
https://qz.com/1182778/the-far-right-wa ... s-in-2017/
https://www.wired.com/story/alt-right-d ... o-succeed/
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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#34 Post by inomaha » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:48 pm

Liberals do control the media, and social media. I'm not sure why that's hard to see given the stated views of the owners and employees, as well as, their registration with the democratic party.

There will be no civil war like the last one. If things come down to violence it will quickly become a cluster**** of epic proportions. It may start off local and targeted to politics, but if reprisals start it would turn into Yugoslavia on steroids. Middle Class against poor, races would split up and segregate even more, urban/rural, etc. Some poor black guy from Compton isn't going to give 2 shits that some middle class white guy votes democrat and supported Obama. The guy looks just like any other "racist" Trump supporter and has stuff he doesn't. Do you think even in a strictly democrat vs republican shootout, that people would somehow not remember that blacks vote over 90% democrat. Talk about an easy sorting method for determining a person's political party.

The oligarchy will simply flee the country and leave us to our demise. There's a good chance the economic, social, and political disruption in the US would drag down most of the interconnected first world with it.

This thread is no different then threads on right wing sites. The posts are almost identical. The listed calls to violence and harassment however is starting to come from the top of the Democratic party. That's somewhat unsettling.
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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#35 Post by AndyH » Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:13 pm

inomaha wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:48 pm
Liberals do control the media, and social media. I'm not sure why that's hard to see given the stated views of the owners and employees, as well as, their registration with the democratic party.
From your perspective, I can understand why you say this. The key words in the above are Democratic party. The Democratic party is not liberal. It's not close to center much less left of center. Even on NPR these days we hear more from Republican political strategists than Dems. That Ms. Clinton was farther right than our current president probably doesn't get much attention in right-wing circles, but she was, and the vast majority of the Dem establishment was there with her. Considering that our 5 or 6 primary media outlets are all owned by very large corporations that are more in harmony with Republicans, and that various anchors and writers are Dems, maybe we should stop thinking of any of them as 'liberals'.

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inomaha wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:48 pm
This thread is no different then threads on right wing sites. The posts are almost identical. The listed calls to violence and harassment however is starting to come from the top of the Democratic party. That's somewhat unsettling.
Care to link to the calls to violence coming from the top of the Democratic party? Thanks.
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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#36 Post by featureless » Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:43 pm

That's an interesting graph, Andy. No wonder I feel partyless these days!

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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#37 Post by eelj » Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:59 pm

AndyH wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:13 pm
inomaha wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:48 pm
Liberals do control the media, and social media. I'm not sure why that's hard to see given the stated views of the owners and employees, as well as, their registration with the democratic party.
From your perspective, I can understand why you say this. The key words in the above are Democratic party. The Democratic party is not liberal. It's not close to center much less left of center. Even on NPR these days we hear more from Republican political strategists than Dems. That Ms. Clinton was farther right than our current president probably doesn't get much attention in right-wing circles, but she was, and the vast majority of the Dem establishment was there with her. Considering that our 5 or 6 primary media outlets are all owned by very large corporations that are more in harmony with Republicans, and that various anchors and writers are Dems, maybe we should stop thinking of any of them as 'liberals'.

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https://www.politicalcompass.org/images/us2016.png
inomaha wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:48 pm
This thread is no different then threads on right wing sites. The posts are almost identical. The listed calls to violence and harassment however is starting to come from the top of the Democratic party. That's somewhat unsettling.
Care to link to the calls to violence coming from the top of the Democratic party? Thanks.
Your graph is important. Hilclin did not even campaign as a liberal, she ignored key states like Wisc Mi and Penn and campaigned in staunch gop states as an alternative to trumps vulgarity.

I think the Sanders phenomina sent terror through the dnc and that trump is looked upon as a godsend to them. Now they feel that they can just stay the course and make trump the key issue and if they win they will be rewarded with more corporate money. Thats what it's all about and has been since the 90s. All we on the ground get is a choice between 2 dung sandwiches, either elephant dung or donkey dung.

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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#38 Post by CDFingers » Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:21 pm

The graph/chart shows why I voted Green. Shoulda been Bernie.

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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#39 Post by harriss » Wed Oct 10, 2018 4:20 pm

featureless wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:43 pm
That's an interesting graph, Andy. No wonder I feel partyless these days!
I've been registered non-party for 47 years.
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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#40 Post by Bisbee » Wed Oct 10, 2018 4:34 pm

CD and I both...
"It is better to be violent, if there is violence in our hearts, than to put on the cloak of non-violence to cover impotence. There is hope for a violent man to become non-violent. There is no such hope for the impotent." -Gandhi

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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#41 Post by AndyH » Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:12 pm

I hear ya, guys. Need more Green candidates.
“There are no dangerous weapons; there are only dangerous men.” Heinlein
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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#42 Post by Bardo » Wed Oct 10, 2018 9:43 pm

HuckleberryFun wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:18 am
Bardo wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 8:21 am
Whats more interesting is how would it be fought? Guerilla style? Trench? Marching through old farms with pack 4 wheelers and 50lb overweight 40-50 somethings carrying ar15's?
If it comes to that it won’t matter to you. You’ll be dead. Some 50 pound overweight forty-something militia goon will have put the muzzle of his AR to the back of your head, pulled the trigger, and buried you in a mass grave in that old farm trench. Maybe you can dissuade him by reasonably talking things over, finding middle ground and compromising. Good luck.

As I said in my OP, I don’t believe that anything like this is imminent, but it is within the realm of possibility now especially if things keep devolving. I see that many on here don’t accept that possibility. We’ll talk about it again in a few years when things become clearer for you. In the meantime I hear there is a sale on gluten free bread at Whole Foods... go pick some up before your next protest march or hot tub party.

If this country doesn’t get its shit together I see two main paths. Either we will continue the long, slow, decline that we’ve been on for over a generation now and end up a dysfunctional near-failed kleptocratic state like Nigeria (for example) in which things barely hold together, or we will simply collapse of our own weight like the Soviet Union did with head-spinning rapidity. Either could happen, or neither.

I just want things to hold together long enough I can enjoy a nice quiet life. Don’t fuck it up for me, ok people?

But without me paying taxes he wouldnt get an EIC check to buy ammo. Checkmate

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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#43 Post by sikacz » Thu Oct 11, 2018 12:29 am

AndyH wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:12 pm
I hear ya, guys. Need more Green candidates.
Need more truely left candidates. Could be green could be democratic socialist. Clinton is a neo-liberal, and neo-liberals are not left. It's the wrong step the democratic party made in the 1990's.
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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#44 Post by HuckleberryFun » Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:05 pm

Thank you all for responding. I was curious what the sense of the forum was on the possibility of “civil war” (umbrella term for widespread violence breaking out) and now I know. The results were about what I expected, with half the people on the forum having a clue and the other half not. I provided the third poll option “can’t we all just get along?” as snark, not thinking anyone would take it seriously. You people crack me up. :roll:

Serious people, not crackpots, have been pondering this. I already cited the New Yorker article on this subject earlier.

Foreign Policy magazine, citing defense experts, put the chances of “civil war” at around 30% in March of last year.
It updates this from time to time, like the clock of the atomic scientists moving closer to midnight.
https://foreignpolicy.com/2017/03/07/wi ... u-tell-me/
https://foreignpolicy.com/2017/03/10/wi ... 0-percent/
https://foreignpolicy.com/2017/06/28/wh ... se-update/

Slate magazine, in 2012, discusses which states would come out on top due to natural advantages. Provided for interest.
http://www.slate.com/blogs/quora/2012/1 ... d_war.html

One side (them) will do anything to win and has been preparing for years to take over in one way or another.
They don’t believe in your conception of “democracy”. The other side (you) wants to talk and compromise and believes our institutions will save us from the abyss if only we can all come together to work out our differences. Yeah, ok.
The same people who make dismissive comments are the same ones that make mocking comments in the Emergency Management forum when we talk about having skills and supplies on hand if everything goes south. It’s uncool, apparently. Yeah, ok.
I sincerely hope and pray that nothing like this ever comes to pass because you are going to lose. Things holding together is your only chance. Chances favor disintegration not happening anytime soon. Whew! Best of luck to you.
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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#45 Post by featureless » Thu Oct 11, 2018 2:22 pm

HuckleberryFun wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:05 pm
The results were about what I expected, with half the people on the forum having a clue and the other half not.
Ouch! :)

Re: emergency management. Derision of "preppers" is common place. I definitely fall into the category of "prepper" but, at least to my mind, more logical reasons. I've got a fault four miles to the east of me and the San Andreas (you saw the movie, right?!) is 30 miles to the west. A large quake is a matter of when, not if (same for Portland). Last year's fires showed me my preps were a good idea and solid but needed a few improvements. Good practice and fortunately still have a town to live in.

I also "prep," to the extent that anyone is able, for climate change. A stocked pantry, medicine cabinet and bookcase, if you will. I have guns because they are fun and a good insurance policy (and many were procured to beat one dumb California law timeline or another). I have a bunch-o-bullets because ammo deserts happen (except for .40, apparently) and because California. I have no delusions of arming the family militia during civil war and winning a weeks-long shootout. I enjoy the emergency management forum and wish it had more activity. Having a plan is never a bad idea and always a good thought exercise.

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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#46 Post by Bardo » Thu Oct 11, 2018 4:13 pm

HuckleberryFun wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:05 pm
Thank you all for responding. I was curious what the sense of the forum was on the possibility of “civil war” (umbrella term for widespread violence breaking out) and now I know. The results were about what I expected, with half the people on the forum having a clue and the other half not. I provided the third poll option “can’t we all just get along?” as snark, not thinking anyone would take it seriously. You people crack me up. :roll:

Serious people, not crackpots, have been pondering this. I already cited the New Yorker article on this subject earlier.

Foreign Policy magazine, citing defense experts, put the chances of “civil war” at around 30% in March of last year.
It updates this from time to time, like the clock of the atomic scientists moving closer to midnight.
https://foreignpolicy.com/2017/03/07/wi ... u-tell-me/
https://foreignpolicy.com/2017/03/10/wi ... 0-percent/
https://foreignpolicy.com/2017/06/28/wh ... se-update/

Slate magazine, in 2012, discusses which states would come out on top due to natural advantages. Provided for interest.
http://www.slate.com/blogs/quora/2012/1 ... d_war.html

One side (them) will do anything to win and has been preparing for years to take over in one way or another.
They don’t believe in your conception of “democracy”. The other side (you) wants to talk and compromise and believes our institutions will save us from the abyss if only we can all come together to work out our differences. Yeah, ok.
The same people who make dismissive comments are the same ones that make mocking comments in the Emergency Management forum when we talk about having skills and supplies on hand if everything goes south. It’s uncool, apparently. Yeah, ok.
I sincerely hope and pray that nothing like this ever comes to pass because you are going to lose. Things holding together is your only chance. Chances favor disintegration not happening anytime soon. Whew! Best of luck to you.
The whole reason the notion isnt really serious is we dont live in the 1800's anymore. If you look at civil wars in 3rd world countries its guerilla exclusively because of military equipment. And now drones are taking a major role. So the idea of two sides firing guns at each other across a field or from a walmart rooftop is as silly as "prepping" for a nuclear wasteland society of nomands trading for gold.

These rightwankers train like theyre special forces not a militia. They are over grown 5 year olds playing army men. Look how easy it was to blow the bitches brains out on ruby ridge or waco. Or my fav LaVoy Finicum. Thats your civil war. A million 5.56's is nothing to an mrap.

A real sort of war would have to come from the state level like the last one. And the majority of red states have yet to balance a budget in 50 years. Not to mention the foreign automaker money in the south drying up real quick.

So i say again where would they get their money for ammo without me paying taxes? You almost as unaware as they are of just how reliant rural whites in southern states are on welfare, federal disease control, healthcare and SS programs to stay alive.

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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#47 Post by HuckleberryFun » Thu Oct 11, 2018 5:24 pm

Bardo wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 4:13 pm
HuckleberryFun wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:05 pm
Thank you all for responding. I was curious what the sense of the forum was on the possibility of “civil war” (umbrella term for widespread violence breaking out) and now I know. The results were about what I expected, with half the people on the forum having a clue and the other half not. I provided the third poll option “can’t we all just get along?” as snark, not thinking anyone would take it seriously. You people crack me up. :roll:

Serious people, not crackpots, have been pondering this. I already cited the New Yorker article on this subject earlier.

Foreign Policy magazine, citing defense experts, put the chances of “civil war” at around 30% in March of last year.
It updates this from time to time, like the clock of the atomic scientists moving closer to midnight.
https://foreignpolicy.com/2017/03/07/wi ... u-tell-me/
https://foreignpolicy.com/2017/03/10/wi ... 0-percent/
https://foreignpolicy.com/2017/06/28/wh ... se-update/

Slate magazine, in 2012, discusses which states would come out on top due to natural advantages. Provided for interest.
http://www.slate.com/blogs/quora/2012/1 ... d_war.html

One side (them) will do anything to win and has been preparing for years to take over in one way or another.
They don’t believe in your conception of “democracy”. The other side (you) wants to talk and compromise and believes our institutions will save us from the abyss if only we can all come together to work out our differences. Yeah, ok.
The same people who make dismissive comments are the same ones that make mocking comments in the Emergency Management forum when we talk about having skills and supplies on hand if everything goes south. It’s uncool, apparently. Yeah, ok.
I sincerely hope and pray that nothing like this ever comes to pass because you are going to lose. Things holding together is your only chance. Chances favor disintegration not happening anytime soon. Whew! Best of luck to you.
The whole reason the notion isnt really serious is we dont live in the 1800's anymore. If you look at civil wars in 3rd world countries its guerilla exclusively because of military equipment. And now drones are taking a major role. So the idea of two sides firing guns at each other across a field or from a walmart rooftop is as silly as "prepping" for a nuclear wasteland society of nomands trading for gold.

These rightwankers train like theyre special forces not a militia. They are over grown 5 year olds playing army men. Look how easy it was to blow the bitches brains out on ruby ridge or waco. Or my fav LaVoy Finicum. Thats your civil war. A million 5.56's is nothing to an mrap.

A real sort of war would have to come from the state level like the last one. And the majority of red states have yet to balance a budget in 50 years. Not to mention the foreign automaker money in the south drying up real quick.

So i say again where would they get their money for ammo without me paying taxes? You almost as unaware as they are of just how reliant rural whites in southern states are on welfare, federal disease control, healthcare and SS programs to stay alive.
Sure, this is not the 1800s, so what? That makes us immune? You think this is “the end of history?”.
Fukuyama was wrong, buddy. We are not exceptional, we are not immune to historical precedent, we are not special.
Where did the Viet Cong get money for bullets? The Mujahedin in Afghanistan? The Shining Path guerillas in Peru? What about countless other guerilla groups that kept a low or medium intensity war going for *years* without a formal tax base? Remember the VC being dismissed as just gooks that would run at first sight of American might? Remember MacArthur saying we had nothing to fear from a “million Chinese laundrymen” who couldn’t shoot straight anyways? Didn’t they all get help? Refer to my earlier post: “the first step in losing a war is underestimating your enemy.” If shooting starts in America you can bet your ass that Putin and Company will happily supply beans and bullets. Hubris will get you killed, my friend.
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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#48 Post by sikacz » Thu Oct 11, 2018 5:34 pm

Not getting on the there will be a civil war, but civil wars have happened recently in non third world countries, in Europe in the Balkans.
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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#49 Post by HuckleberryFun » Thu Oct 11, 2018 6:02 pm

sikacz wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 5:34 pm
Not getting on the there will be a civil war, but civil wars have happened recently in non third world countries, in Europe in the Balkans.
The Balkans is instructive. I go to the Siege of Sarajevo and other aspects of the war for lessons. The former Yugoslavia is like the USA in that it was severely factionalized, mostly along ethnic lines. When Marshall Tito (the one holding it all together) died, Yugoslavia was gone in less than ten years. Prosperity and opportunity was our Tito: when ever greater wealth was gone forever for most Americans things started unraveling. Some call it judgment...


Lewis Prothero: So I read that the former United States is so desperate for medical supplies that they have allegedly sent several containers filled with wheat and tobacco. A gesture, they said, of good will. You wanna know what I think? Well, you’re listening to my show, so I will assume you do… I think it’s high time we let the colonies know what we really think of them. I think its payback time for a little tea party they threw for us a few hundred years ago. I say we go down to those docks tonight and dump that crap where everything from the Ulcered Sphincter of Arse-erica belongs! Who’s with me? Who’s bloody with me?

[audience applauds]

Lewis Prothero: Did you like that? USA… Ulcered Sphincter of Arse-erica, I mean what else can you say? Here was a country that had everything, absolutely everything. And now, 20 years later, is what? The world’s biggest leper colony. Why? Godlessness. Let me say that again… Godlessness. It wasn’t the war they started. It wasn’t the plague they created. It was Judgement. No one escapes their past. No one escapes Judgement. You think he’s not up there? You think he’s not watching over this country? How else can you explain it? He tested us, but we came through. We did what we had to do. Islington. Enfield. I was there, I saw it all. Immigrants, Muslims, homosexuals, terrorists. Disease-ridden degenerates. They had to go. Strength through unity. Unity through faith. I’m a God-fearing Englishman and I’m goddamn proud of it!
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methodmissing
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Re: Is Civil War Coming?

#50 Post by methodmissing » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:05 pm

I live in Chicago. The place is a house of cards held together by silly putty and corporate money. It would not take much to topple the city. A multiple-days power outage, gas shortage, water supply shortage, or the wrong moment sparking a civil disturbance into a full riot. We were on high alert a week ago for the sentencing of Jason Van Dyke.

I live on the edge of the city. Two miles south of me there is a shooting about once a week. Four miles south, it's ten times that. The houses around me fly POW*MIA and Blue Lives Matter flags, and have Thin Blue Line Punisher and FOP stickers on the rear window of their SUVs. I don't know my neighbors really well, but I'm trying to make inroads.

A month ago, there was an incident on the train line I usually take home which stopped all trains for hours while they called in a bomb squad. It was a false alarm, but I and thousands of other people had to walk, cab, or bus out of there. It's a twelve mile walk home and not all of it is the safest.

Oh, and the City's bond status is Junk and they're going to go forward with a harebrained scheme to issue additional special bonds to raise money on a bet that they'll average %7 growth for the next ten years. Or go bankrupt, and which city services will get cut I wonder.
Cut police and crime goes up. Cut education and kids are out of school and crime goes up. Cut water and sanitation and we all stew in our own shit and lead tainted water, crime and illness goes up. Cut roads and transportation and the roads, bridges, trains and buses service fail and people can't get to work, get fired, turn to crime. But civil pensioners will continue to collect their pensions at their Florida beach houses. They can probably even rebuild the ones that were flattened by Michael.

I consider it probable that some infrastructure or political failure is likely to occur in the next 10 years and the fallout from that may very well fall on my home in the form of increased gang activity, local militia activism, national guard crackdown, refugee looting, and other assorted shit.

Is there going to be a Civil War? War is the state in which civil contracts and norms are suspended. Yes, especially in hotbeds of inequality like Chicago. And it will look like widespread looting and gang violence against ad-hoc civilian militia groups, if we aren't all disarmed by then.

There's already a Culture War and a Political War. The norms and civil contracts are being suspended. Anything goes. It's a war by papercuts and attrition. We will win the Cultural War if we can live through the Political War.

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