Re: Reloading - The Time vs. Money Trade-Off

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I just re-read this thread from the beginning.

I fuckin love this place.

I reload because I can pick the velocity / bullet weight combination that feels best in my hand in a particular gun, for any gun.

Finding the right load for it can be the thing that makes and old gun shoot like a new gun.

I reload because I spend other evenings working on making myself the best paring knife I can think of. Because I butcher whole ducks when I am making duck confit. Because my dream job consists of making specialized tools for other people to do good work with. Because I hang my own curtains. Because I make frames for the brilliant drawings of the woman I love. Because making things is who I am and if I shoot, then I make cartridges.

I reload because I am a creature of certain kinds of pleasure.

Re: Reloading - The Time vs. Money Trade-Off

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I just got back from a gravel pit, my wife and I like to scrounge brass and hunt for agates. I took my 30-06 Springfield along with 40 rds of ammo and had a great time shooting. This thread deals with reasons for reloading and almost all the reasons deal with whether it is economical enough to justify. If a person owns a 357 mag. they can shoot 38 wadcutters for the economy and because they are much more pleasant than full house magnums. Rifles have no option you buy the full house stuff and shoot till your shoulder is black and blue. What I shot today is not available over the counter, 170gr cast lead slugs over a number of different powder charges that launch the slugs at well below 2000 fps, the recoil and report is quite pleasant. I found a load that is probably around 1500 fps and very accurate easily minute of rabbit head at fifty yrds. As to the economy the slugs are cast by me with free wheel weights and the brass came from one of three big coffee cans full of brass that I picked up off the ground the last couple of years. For me scrounging brass and free lead and turning them into excellent ammo just rounds out the hobby of owning and shooting guns. I don't own rifles like fukshot and paladin so creating ammo for 300 yrd shooting is not necessary to me but mouse fart 06 and 30-30 ammo that is extremely accurate at 100 yrds is a fun pastime for me. Its not that expensive to get started with a Lee single stage kit and I'm sure the members that have started in the last couple of years here will never buy another box of ammo again.
"Hillary Clinton is the finest, bravest, kindest, the most wonderful person I've ever known in my whole life" Raymond Shaw

Re: Reloading - The Time vs. Money Trade-Off

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SwampGrouch wrote:
Ultravox wrote:Can you expand on point number 5?

What would be ethical/unethical about reloading?
Reloading is recycling brass.
...And lead if you cast your own. I recently weighed the components going into .38 special that I just loaded, and 97 percent is recycled (lead) and reused (brass). The primer and powder accounted for only 3% of the total weight.
We live at a time when emotions and feelings count more than truth,
and there is a vast ignorance of science.
James Lovelock

It is impossible to defeat an ignorant man in argument.
-William G. McAdoo, lawyer and politician (1863-1941)

Re: Reloading - The Time vs. Money Trade-Off

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Trouble is, I shoot 'em up faster than I can make them. And I shoot bolt- and single- actions!

I've been reloading for a long time now, and I can say it's cheaper to reload than not to. I figure if I can watch a Giants' game while I reload, no time is being wasted. Go Giants!

CDFingers
Crazy cat peekin' through a lace bandana
like a one-eyed Cheshire, like a diamond-eyed Jack

Re: Reloading - The Time vs. Money Trade-Off

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Truth be told, I don't think I bought anything new. I got all my equipment at gun shows and gun shops that sell used. It took a couple years. But I think I saved pots of money, which I spent on guns, powder, and bullets. The rest of the savings I wasted.

CDFingers
Crazy cat peekin' through a lace bandana
like a one-eyed Cheshire, like a diamond-eyed Jack

Re: Reloading - The Time vs. Money Trade-Off

34
Heres another way to look at it. Reloading is fun and interesting, you get to craft ammo and you can feel a great sense of accomplishment when it is far superior to store bought. You will learn more about not only your firearm but firearms in general. The fact that you save money per round fired is a slam dunk, its also a healthy hobby healthy because you would have to be a moron to smoke and drink while handling explosives.
"Hillary Clinton is the finest, bravest, kindest, the most wonderful person I've ever known in my whole life" Raymond Shaw

Re: Reloading - The Time vs. Money Trade-Off

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I just reloaded these. With a box of 45-70 costing between $35 and $150 (that's right, a box of 20) my savings will add up fast. My cost will go down even more drastically when I get the bullet mold for this gun. For size comparison the cartridge on the right is 357 Magnum.
GuitarsAndGuns had it right when she said on another thread that for the cost of a few boxes of ammo you could buy another gun.
Image
We live at a time when emotions and feelings count more than truth,
and there is a vast ignorance of science.
James Lovelock

It is impossible to defeat an ignorant man in argument.
-William G. McAdoo, lawyer and politician (1863-1941)

Re: Reloading - The Time vs. Money Trade-Off

36
Here's another example, involving another "cheap" round, the .45 (Long) Colt.

I've got two loads for .45 Colt, mild and wild. The mild one is SAAMI-spec, around 11,000 PSI, using a medium charge of Titegroup under a 200gr cast boolit. The wild one, at 30,000 PSI, uses a mighty healthy charge of 2400 under a 255gr cast boolit, is as powerful as a .44 Magnum round, and was designed for the Super Redhawk 454.

To buy a box of the "mild" load costs $39 at my LGS. If I'm extremely lucky, I can find SAAMI-spec .45 Colt for $30. I make that same box for $5.00. That's a $25 cost savings per box.

To buy a box of the "wild" load...well, my wild load is comparable to Buffalo Bore's .45 Colt +P load, maybe even just a bit hotter. A box of 50 of that stuff is $80.03 from Buffalo Bore's Web site. I make that same box for $8.00. Yes, that's a $72 reduction...per box.

My Lee Pro 1000 for .45 Colt cost me $170, including the case collator and shipping. The mould for the mild load was $55 including handles; same for the mould for the wild load. The mild load took 10 boxes to get that money back. The wild load...that took just over 3 boxes--call it 3.5.

As IBM used to say, "You Make The Call." For me, it's most definitely worth the time, and it's fun, too.
"SF Liberal With A Gun + Free Software Advocate"
http://www.sanfranciscoliberalwithagun.com/
http://www.liberalsguncorner.com/
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Re: Reloading - The Time vs. Money Trade-Off

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CowboyT wrote:Here's another example, involving another "cheap" round, the .45 (Long) Colt.

I've got two loads for .45 Colt, mild and wild. The mild one is SAAMI-spec, around 11,000 PSI, using a medium charge of Titegroup under a 200gr cast boolit. The wild one, at 30,000 PSI, uses a mighty healthy charge of 2400 under a 255gr cast boolit, is as powerful as a .44 Magnum round, and was designed for the Super Redhawk 454.

To buy a box of the "mild" load costs $39 at my LGS. If I'm extremely lucky, I can find SAAMI-spec .45 Colt for $30. I make that same box for $5.00. That's a $25 cost savings per box.

To buy a box of the "wild" load...well, my wild load is comparable to Buffalo Bore's .45 Colt +P load, maybe even just a bit hotter. A box of 50 of that stuff is $80.03 from Buffalo Bore's Web site. I make that same box for $8.00. Yes, that's a $72 reduction...per box.

My Lee Pro 1000 for .45 Colt cost me $170, including the case collator and shipping. The mould for the mild load was $55 including handles; same for the mould for the wild load. The mild load took 10 boxes to get that money back. The wild load...that took just over 3 boxes--call it 3.5.

As IBM used to say, "You Make The Call." For me, it's most definitely worth the time, and it's fun, too.
It's a lot of fun for me too. Half the hobby to me is in the garage making my own cartridges and tailoring the loads for my guns. It also feels good to have a bit of an independence from what the industry thinks I need, and to be more self-sufficient.

Here's something I just finished... I took my new to me, Marlin Guide Gun to the range yesterday for the first time and got to shoot some of the cast bullets I made on Wednesday. They didn't tumble, they flew straight, and were very accurate. They also didn't lead the bore, so I guess I got everything right. The Guide Gun really liked them. Recoil was pretty stiff, but not "sharp" - more of a push. Shooting my 270 Winchester with full-house loads afterwards felt pretty darn light. Fun stuff! I love my "shoulder-cannon!"
Image
We live at a time when emotions and feelings count more than truth,
and there is a vast ignorance of science.
James Lovelock

It is impossible to defeat an ignorant man in argument.
-William G. McAdoo, lawyer and politician (1863-1941)

Re: Reloading - The Time vs. Money Trade-Off

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Good luck shooting .22 right now...and for the last 6 months.

Given the current ammo situation, I figured it important to remind folks of reloading's major, and most important, benefit:

AMMO AVAILABILITY.

Other people out here are scurrying around trying desperately to get ammo. Heck, I followed in one other person's footsteps and sold a 550-pack of .22LR for $60 at a recent gun show. And that was a bargain compared to what the folks were charging inside the show.

By contrast, I have ZERO ammo availability problems. Just got home from some range practice with the Security-Six and the 96/44 levergun...again. And I do this all the time, as in several times a week. My marksmanship continues to improve as a result.

Why can I do that? Because I prepared myself for the inevitable tragic event that would cause the antis to go into overdrive (which they did after Sandy Hook).

THAT is the primary reason why I reload. The major cost savings are just a really nice side benefit.
"SF Liberal With A Gun + Free Software Advocate"
http://www.sanfranciscoliberalwithagun.com/
http://www.liberalsguncorner.com/
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Re: Reloading - The Time vs. Money Trade-Off

40
Yeah, fortunately I have what I need to reload .223 for now. I am hoping to have a swaging setup for .224 projectiles by December and then I won't have to worry about not finding bullets. Should be casting for 9mm/.380 by the end of August (funding and heat will have me not melting lead or myself before then!) and .45 ACP by September.

Then I just need a few 8# kegs and a few cases of primers.

[1/28/2014] ETA: Woof, timeframe was a BIT off back then...Feb will see my new (to me) 9mm showing up, should have a 12 gauge by my birfdai in March and a .45 ACP launcher before the meeting.
Last edited by ErikO on Tue Jan 28, 2014 4:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.
In a bacon, egg and cheese sandwich the chicken and cow are involved while the pig is committed.

Re: Reloading - The Time vs. Money Trade-Off

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I guess I don't look at reloading like a "time vs money" sort of thing. I know that yeah, I'm saving some money. How much exactly I'm really not sure. But I truly enjoy developing a charge that gets me a tight group, and I've always loved constructing things that are functional. Reloading speaks to that part of me big time.

I just look at is as a really cool hobby, and it's pretty much separate from shooting for me. I still am only using a single stage, so I can't really churn out a ton of ammo all at once although I'm pretty efficient. Particularly during baseball season, I just like to put on a game in the background and work on some ammo for a few hours. It's kind of a meditative thing for me that happens to yield ammo. A bonus on top of that is that it's readily available, cheaper and more accurate than what I find at the gun store, and no one is rationing it to me either.

Re: Reloading - The Time vs. Money Trade-Off

43
Fukshot wrote:I just re-read this thread from the beginning.

I fuckin love this place.

I reload because I can pick the velocity / bullet weight combination that feels best in my hand in a particular gun, for any gun.

Finding the right load for it can be the thing that makes and old gun shoot like a new gun.

I reload because I spend other evenings working on making myself the best paring knife I can think of. Because I butcher whole ducks when I am making duck confit. Because my dream job consists of making specialized tools for other people to do good work with. Because I hang my own curtains. Because I make frames for the brilliant drawings of the woman I love. Because making things is who I am and if I shoot, then I make cartridges.

I reload because I am a creature of certain kinds of pleasure.
So you are a tinkerer! I think that is the number 1 reason - to DIY. Can we MAKE to do a spot on reloading?
"If the misery of the poor be caused not by the laws of nature, but by our institutions, great is our sin” – Charles Darwin

Re: Reloading - The Time vs. Money Trade-Off

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I reload for my bolt guns for the accuracy. Being able to make adjustments to seating depth and neck tension makes a big difference. As well as a much wider variety of powder and bullets than you can from factory loaded ammunition. I enjoy spending some of this time with friends and family doing brass prep. and research for new loads as we all shoot together.

Re: Reloading - The Time vs. Money Trade-Off

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You remind me of a friend who also reloads for precision. He's retentive about attention to detail regarding his loads. The results show it, too; he routinely gets 1/3 MOA with both his 7mm RM and his .308 Win. Both are bolt guns.

Why does he do this? He's a hunter and an excellent shot. To quote him: "if there's an inch-and-a-half gap in the brush where I can get that neck shot on Bambi for the dinner table, and the shot's at 100 yards, I know I can thread that needle." And he does. Those neck shots preserve a lot of meat (he knows the anatomy of deer very well), and his kids thus get fed healthy, lean, organic cuts of meat on a regular basis.
"SF Liberal With A Gun + Free Software Advocate"
http://www.sanfranciscoliberalwithagun.com/
http://www.liberalsguncorner.com/
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Re: Reloading - The Time vs. Money Trade-Off

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I'm a firm believer that in order to maintain competency in SD style shooting I personally need to put at least 400 rounds a month down range. My Wife - the same. So, we are burning 800 rounds of .32, 9mm, .38 Special and now (soon) .380 ACP. Even cheap factory ammo would set me back maybe $15+ a box of 50 on average. And then I have to shoot whatever I can find which is often not ammunition I wanna run thru my guns.

So, I reload at an average of $6.00 a box of 50 and I have complete control over quality and type of ammunition/bullets and power level. Hot rounds for SD and lower power stuff for target and SD practice.

Besides exercising my "control freak" side it is simple - I could not afford to practice enough to get to the proficiency level I want unless I reload. It takes some time away from other things but usually I do it in batches at as little as 15 minutes at a time or even less. I'll sort brass while waiting for tea water to boil or prime cases while cooking dinner...things like that.

For me, reloading completes the circle of being a hand gunner and it is a spiritual release. I often shoot on Sunday mornings practicing move/draw/shoot/reholster and when asked, I tell people "this is how I pray...the Farm range is my church" and watch them scratch their heads.

VooDoo

VooDoo
Tyrants disarm the people they intend to oppress.

I am sworn to support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic.

Re: Reloading - The Time vs. Money Trade-Off

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Simmer down wrote:Reloading benefit for me is more than money. In fact, reloading costs exceed what I used to spend at the store. What I get is a relaxing activity that lets me expand my shooting experience. It is a way for me to get my Tinkering Fix. It fulfills my inner miser. I like to try to master things and this is often a challenge.
Can't agree more. :beer2:
"Well there's always been groups of people who never could see eye to eye. But I always thought if they had a chance to sit down and talk face to face they might realize they got a lot in common."
- Chris LeDoux

Re: Reloading - The Time vs. Money Trade-Off

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Been doing some reloading of .45 ACP recently. Anyone price .45 ACP recently? In my neck o' the woods, even Tulammo is $20/box. The non-bimetal variety, e. g. Winchester or Federal, is $26/box. These are all 50 round boxes of range-practice FMJ. Many ranges, including mine, don't allow bimetal-jacketed bullets. Reloading that cartridge is a big cost-saver, too.

But what about your time? Isn't your time worth something?

Of course it is! When the duty day's done, if I don't feel like gardening or researching some IT topic that evening, I might go reload for an hour, maybe two. That's my "down time" after work. The "Zen" takes over, and I get into this nice state of alert relaxation, if you can imagine that. It's considerably more rewarding than, for example, sittin' in front of the idiot box (TV). My time is worth way more to me than to absorb the garbage currently on TV.
"SF Liberal With A Gun + Free Software Advocate"
http://www.sanfranciscoliberalwithagun.com/
http://www.liberalsguncorner.com/
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