Lead free ammo that's required for hunting in CA isn't cheap. I know, of course, that I'll need send a few of those expensive lead-free bullets down range in order to zero the rifle before actually taking a shot in the field on the day. However, between now and "on the day" I'd like to practice with some cheap flat base and boat tail ammo.
The expensive lead free stuff is 150gr, the cheap steel off-range stuff is 140gr, and the cheap non-steel ammo for the range is 145gr. I know each of the cheap cases will require a re-zero when switching but can I expect such switching it up to addle me "on the day" due to practicing with two different bullets and hunting with yet another?
Yeah, a "noob" question, I know. I am indeed a newbie, however, when it comes to hunting with a rifle so I want to get things right before "the day".
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
2Practice and zero your rifle as much as you can afford with the expensive hunting ammo, then switch to the lead stuff and aim for bull but shoot for consistent groups, wherever they land on the paper.
'Sorry stupid people but there are some definite disadvantages to being stupid."
-John Cleese
-John Cleese
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
3If you are rolling your own, you might be able to dial-in the loads so they have similar POI at a given distance, but drop and windage are going to vary because of bullet shape and sectional density.
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
4Mason wrote:Practice and zero your rifle as much as you can afford with the expensive hunting ammo, then switch to the lead stuff and aim for bull but shoot for consistent groups, wherever they land on the paper.
I think I did read elsewhere as well about this. It was deemed important to zero a new rifle with good ammo, finding what it likes best. Once the rifle was deemed accurate with a certain ammo, that would be the ammo to shoot when accuracy is critical. Kinda like establishing a baseline for the rifle's accuracy, I guess.
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
5I'm not there yet and the amount of time to develop another skillset outside of simple marksmanship is prohibitive for me. When I retire, perhaps.senorgrand wrote:If you are rolling your own, you might be able to dial-in the loads so they have similar POI at a given distance, but drop and windage are going to vary because of bullet shape and sectional density.
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
6What caliber, what distance, what animal?
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
7Once I figured I could load 308 for like 20 cents a round, it seemed very doable.m1ckDELTA wrote:I'm not there yet and the amount of time to develop another skillset outside of simple marksmanship is prohibitive for me. When I retire, perhaps.senorgrand wrote:If you are rolling your own, you might be able to dial-in the loads so they have similar POI at a given distance, but drop and windage are going to vary because of bullet shape and sectional density.
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
8I'll try to start with feral pig because of state hunting regs.Marlene wrote:What caliber, what distance, what animal?
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
9How much have you spent on equipment and how many square feet does your reloading station occupy? How much time does a "reloading session" take up in your day?senorgrand wrote:Once I figured I could load 308 for like 20 cents a round, it seemed very doable.m1ckDELTA wrote:I'm not there yet and the amount of time to develop another skillset outside of simple marksmanship is prohibitive for me. When I retire, perhaps.senorgrand wrote:If you are rolling your own, you might be able to dial-in the loads so they have similar POI at a given distance, but drop and windage are going to vary because of bullet shape and sectional density.
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
10I bought my reloading equipment off craigslist. I think I spent $50, plus about $40 in additional equipment. Reloading for a bolt gun is a great trade off because it's low volume of reloads. It probably takes-up about 2 square feet. Marlene has a really cool portable setup.m1ckDELTA wrote:How much have you spent on equipment and how many square feet does your reloading station occupy? How much time does a "reloading session" take up in your day?senorgrand wrote:Once I figured I could load 308 for like 20 cents a round, it seemed very doable.m1ckDELTA wrote:I'm not there yet and the amount of time to develop another skillset outside of simple marksmanship is prohibitive for me. When I retire, perhaps.senorgrand wrote:If you are rolling your own, you might be able to dial-in the loads so they have similar POI at a given distance, but drop and windage are going to vary because of bullet shape and sectional density.
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
11I'd love to see pix of the portable setup!senorgrand wrote:
Once I figured I could load 308 for like 20 cents a round, it seemed very doable.
I bought my reloading equipment off craigslist. I think I spent $50, plus about $40 in additional equipment. Reloading for a bolt gun is a great trade off because it's low volume of reloads. It probably takes-up about 2 square feet. Marlene has a really cool portable setup.
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
12https://leeprecision.com/lee-loader-308-win.html
slow but cheap ($40) and has its own appeal to the meticulous. i own a fancy press and several of these. over time you will want other stuff, but this can get you started.
some vendors sell it cheaper. much cheaper.
slow but cheap ($40) and has its own appeal to the meticulous. i own a fancy press and several of these. over time you will want other stuff, but this can get you started.
some vendors sell it cheaper. much cheaper.
i'm retired. what's your excuse?
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
13It can't be this easy; surely he cut some corners:lurker wrote:https://leeprecision.com/lee-loader-308-win.html
slow but cheap ($40) and has its own appeal to the meticulous. i own a fancy press and several of these. over time you will want other stuff, but this can get you started.
some vendors sell it cheaper. much cheaper.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_zD6B6Ph60
Okay, this seems more like it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-tzaULt1rs
And this seems to not gloss over some of the difficulties:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMN2ZtCEgWk
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
14listen to the man: "this is all it takes".m1ckDELTA wrote: And this seems to not gloss over some of the difficulties:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMN2ZtCEgWk
effing internet.
i'm retired. what's your excuse?
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
15We still don't know what caliber.
There's practice in trigger control and general marksmanship that can be done with inexpensive jacketed lead bullets, standard fmj. Since we don't know the caliber, we can't suggest exact bullets, but if we assume it's .308, there are 150 gr fmj lead core, and then there's 150 grain copper. The copper ones will be a bit longer, so they will fly a little differently. Zero with the inexpensive stuff, then shoot three of the copper: two to get a group after which you move your scope, then one to see if it's OK. Then you work on trigger, breath, and general marksmanship.
Now, pigs in California aren't generally going to be long shots, as mostly they're found in brush, so closer than 100 meters. You're not going to get that much of a change in impact between the two at 100 meters. Still, to waste three copper bullets isn't that expensive if you reload.
CDFingers
There's practice in trigger control and general marksmanship that can be done with inexpensive jacketed lead bullets, standard fmj. Since we don't know the caliber, we can't suggest exact bullets, but if we assume it's .308, there are 150 gr fmj lead core, and then there's 150 grain copper. The copper ones will be a bit longer, so they will fly a little differently. Zero with the inexpensive stuff, then shoot three of the copper: two to get a group after which you move your scope, then one to see if it's OK. Then you work on trigger, breath, and general marksmanship.
Now, pigs in California aren't generally going to be long shots, as mostly they're found in brush, so closer than 100 meters. You're not going to get that much of a change in impact between the two at 100 meters. Still, to waste three copper bullets isn't that expensive if you reload.
CDFingers
Crazy cat peekin' through a lace bandana
like a one-eyed Cheshire, like a diamond-eyed Jack
like a one-eyed Cheshire, like a diamond-eyed Jack
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
16Fingers has it, except that it’ll take you more than three to adjust between the two if the points of impact vary much and you aren’t an old hand with a rifle like he is.
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
17If you want a starter Lee reloaded press cheap, PM me.
I do like the Lee Loader, but if you are reloading in the late hours the hammering involved cramps your style.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I do like the Lee Loader, but if you are reloading in the late hours the hammering involved cramps your style.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Bleeding Heart Liberal with Second Amendment Benefits.
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
18Thanks for the offer. If I were to do anything it would have to be compact and portable like the Classic Loader or a hand press kit.drigeba wrote:If you want a starter Lee reloaded press cheap, PM me.
I do like the Lee Loader, but if you are reloading in the late hours the hammering involved cramps your style.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
19That is really appealing as an afternoon project when camping. The kit and additional parts are small enough to keep in a dedicated "reloading bag".lurker wrote:https://leeprecision.com/lee-loader-308-win.html
slow but cheap ($40) and has its own appeal to the meticulous. i own a fancy press and several of these. over time you will want other stuff, but this can get you started.
some vendors sell it cheaper. much cheaper.
Would this shopping list be missing anything?
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B013X ... CE4G&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008M ... 0DER&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000N ... 0DER&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/Frankford-Arsena ... wder+scale
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000G ... 0DER&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00YX ... C20E&psc=1
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
20Looks like your list is ok and you are good to go! The Lee Loader is a great tool to start out with since it slows you down and makes you pay attention to every step.
Check out Titan Reloading. They seem to have the best prices and availability on everything Lee.
The Reloader press is a bench mounted version of the hand press you mention. It's small and compact. I should still have it in a couple months when you tire of using the Lee Loader on a regular basis...
As to projectile weight, when i asked the folks at Barnes, they suggested going to a lighter weight with their copper bullets than lead. I use the 130 Grain as the copper equivalent of a 147 to 150 grain FMJ. I also found that the point of aim is very close and needs minimal adjustment when switching ammo. For a flat shooting round like .308 for hunting, you only need "minute of hog" accuracy.
Check out Titan Reloading. They seem to have the best prices and availability on everything Lee.
The Reloader press is a bench mounted version of the hand press you mention. It's small and compact. I should still have it in a couple months when you tire of using the Lee Loader on a regular basis...
As to projectile weight, when i asked the folks at Barnes, they suggested going to a lighter weight with their copper bullets than lead. I use the 130 Grain as the copper equivalent of a 147 to 150 grain FMJ. I also found that the point of aim is very close and needs minimal adjustment when switching ammo. For a flat shooting round like .308 for hunting, you only need "minute of hog" accuracy.
Bleeding Heart Liberal with Second Amendment Benefits.
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
21I like the hand press pretty well, except for how slow it is (not fun for auto pistol cartridges...you can burn up an hour's work in one minute, maybe two if you're limited to ten-round mags and don't have five of them). I can't vouch for big rifle cartridges, but I find it works well for .44 Mag with carbide dies and no case lube, which requires quite a bit of force on the case. In fact, they drag so badly that pulling them out leaves some marks on the top of the rim! I should probably use a little lube. Anyway, for a bolt gun I guess you can just neck-size, so that would be super-easy.m1ckDELTA wrote:Thanks for the offer. If I were to do anything it would have to be compact and portable like the Classic Loader or a hand press kit.drigeba wrote:If you want a starter Lee reloaded press cheap, PM me.
I do like the Lee Loader, but if you are reloading in the late hours the hammering involved cramps your style.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
My only question is whether it takes three hands to balance a rifle bullet on the case mouth while holding the hand press and working it with your other two...
IMR4227: Zero to 900 in 0.001 seconds
I'm only killing paper and my self-esteem.
I'm only killing paper and my self-esteem.
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
22I kinda wondered that about the hand press till I watched a bunch of videos. From what I saw I actually like the visceral nature of the Lee Classic, though. It's very "frontier".Buck13 wrote:I like the hand press pretty well, except for how slow it is (not fun for auto pistol cartridges...you can burn up an hour's work in one minute, maybe two if you're limited to ten-round mags and don't have five of them). I can't vouch for big rifle cartridges, but I find it works well for .44 Mag with carbide dies and no case lube, which requires quite a bit of force on the case. In fact, they drag so badly that pulling them out leaves some marks on the top of the rim! I should probably use a little lube. Anyway, for a bolt gun I guess you can just neck-size, so that would be super-easy.m1ckDELTA wrote:Thanks for the offer. If I were to do anything it would have to be compact and portable like the Classic Loader or a hand press kit.drigeba wrote:If you want a starter Lee reloaded press cheap, PM me.
I do like the Lee Loader, but if you are reloading in the late hours the hammering involved cramps your style.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
My only question is whether it takes three hands to balance a rifle bullet on the case mouth while holding the hand press and working it with your other two...
Re: Practicing w/ 145 grain lead, then hunting with 150 copp
23I started with the Lee hand press- it works fine, and does okay for bottleneck rifle cartridges in small quantities. Definitely nice to be able to keep it in a shoebox if space is limited, but the lee classic and the reloading stand have a pretty small footprint as well, and it's a much nicer experience.