SHTF...do you really need a helmet?

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A video suggestion pops up in my YouTube feed with some guy giving his top 5 helmets for your SHTF BoB. I'm wondering what this guy thinks is going to happen? Is he expecting fragments from artillery, mortars, and grenades? His previous videos have shown 7.62x24 Tokarev will burn through most helmets and rounds from bolt action Mosins, which just about everyone has in their bag, will let a front on shot bounce into your brain pan. Is there something I'm not getting here? If the idea is to travel light to your bunker, why add the extra weight? Is there a use for helmets outside of using that old M1 steel pot to boil water in or look tacticool?
Cynistoicureanism: The world view best expressed by "I can't trust 'em any farther then I can throw 'em, There's nothing I can do about it anyway, So let's have a drink".

Re: SHTF...do you really need a helmet?

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nobody knows, depends on what kind of S and what kind of F. probably not. attracts attention, adds bulk and weight. iirc, many military rifle rounds were specifically designed to penetrate both sides of a steel pot. with that in mind, most helmets are intended to stop fragments, not bullets.
that said, when i was equipping myself with web gear, gen1 night vision, gas masks, looking at body armor and such, i was going to get a british kevlar paratroop helmet, some protection without that stylin' stormtrooper vibe. and then 9/11 happened and the supply dried up, and i haven't seen one since.

it's ok, don't expect i'll ever need any of it. probably should sell it next time a dem could get elected.
i'm retired. what's your excuse?

Re: SHTF...do you really need a helmet?

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experience has taught the military that various kinds of protective gear saves lives.. helmets flak Vests body armor ear plugs steel tor shoes flash gear and flash cream real protective mask ( not the $20 dollar collector specials that don't actually work [we can talk about that in detail if anybody wants] since they don't actually work or protect you from anything they seem to be highly popular.. go figure... because half of an NCO's life consists of making sure people are using safety gear that they absolutely hate wearing.

even this https://armour-wear.com/shop/all/bulletproof-underwear/ save a lot of folks from IED's should have seen the originals.. looked like you were wearing 5 pairs of depends.. I mean loose combat style uniforms like BDU's can only hide so many faults..

You guys and gals are civilians.. you get to choose for yourself what or what not safety gear to wear..

It's always a trade off .. just like a tank that only has one size engine ( I humanpower, but great mileage) speed or mobility or protection or fire power improve one got to take away from the other 3 it's the old wildcat x zero story.. ( Wildcats and FM4's had a 7.1 to 1 kill ratio .. very respectable.. but the Zero got the press) Hoplites or light infantry...

Professionally.. as far as helmets go I would seriously look at the local risk of volcanoes and earthquakes under tall buildings type threats and look at some of the construction or even bike helmets or foot ball helmets something designed to mitigate the local credible threat.. and they are much lighter... I say this because one of the against arguments for wearing helmets was how much artillery airburst or head shot sniping snipers do you expect to encounter.. if you actually do see head wounds from gunshot or artillery as a problem then get military level gear and hope the bad guys don't have RPG's

Gas masks.. I have a whole library of links and tech info on that subject.. long story short version no country has ever sold effective gas masks s surplus .. the rubber gets age crcks the elastic goes limp and filters expire starting at date of manufacture NOT date the can is opened .. they dope the activated charcoal with various chemicals to make it more effective against specific war gasses and they have to use several type of chemicals in that doping to handle a variety of war gasses .. and they interact and break down in the sealed can over time.. the containers are marked as to shelf life after that.. it's not so much that they are ineffective as that they may be toxic all on their own.. and many older filters use asbestos .. filters great.. they even used to use it in cigarette filters .. some specific examples http://www.approvedgasmasks.com/defective-masks.htm

Since I am more concerned about riot agents at peaceful protests .. I carry a readi-msk http://www.shepherdsurvival.com/readi-mask-adult/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYTF5guxqFc pepper spray in the face https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DcjCCXBna18 how to use and don

they come in kids sizes and fit in a pocket.. I use them as part of my EDC also good to have stuff https://www.amazon.com/ea-Fox-Labs-Sude ... B0094BFFQ0 recommend both the wipes and the binary decon bottled stuff .especially if you have hair on you head or face.. wipes don't do well on hair.

Safety/ protective gear is not where you want to save money// although good stuff is not expensive https://www.uline.com/Grp_259/Hard-Hats base model starts at $10 and as you might have noticed Readi masks $7 or $6 with the volume discount ( 2 or more) one time use

actually cheaper to do it right and buy gear that works

Re: SHTF...do you really need a helmet?

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We saw all those alt-right militias in C'ville. Pretend soldiers.

Motorcycle helmets are designed for both impact and penetration protection. Will it stop a .223 round? Probably not, not even the kevlar ones. But the Snell Rating on MC helmets is probably the best indicator of penetration resistance, although, curiously not necessarily the safest helmet for road use--unless your regularly riding include race grade speeds.
"Even if the bee could explain to the fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly could never understand."

Re: SHTF...do you really need a helmet?

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YankeeTarheel wrote:We saw all those alt-right militias in C'ville. Pretend soldiers.

Motorcycle helmets are designed for both impact and penetration protection. Will it stop a .223 round? Probably not, not even the kevlar ones. But the Snell Rating on MC helmets is probably the best indicator of penetration resistance, although, curiously not necessarily the safest helmet for road use--unless your regularly riding include race grade speeds.
I've got an old helmet that needs to be retired. I could do some testing, but it would be limited to 9mm and 22lr. However, motorcycle helmets are designed primarily to diffuse force, so I suspect protection would be minimal against a projectile. I could put a small water melon inside the helmet for more realistic testing. I'm not quite sure if that would be funny or macabre. :rolleyes:
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Re: SHTF...do you really need a helmet?

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MaxWyatt wrote:
YankeeTarheel wrote:We saw all those alt-right militias in C'ville. Pretend soldiers.

Motorcycle helmets are designed for both impact and penetration protection. Will it stop a .223 round? Probably not, not even the kevlar ones. But the Snell Rating on MC helmets is probably the best indicator of penetration resistance, although, curiously not necessarily the safest helmet for road use--unless your regularly riding include race grade speeds.
I've got an old helmet that needs to be retired. I could do some testing, but it would be limited to 9mm and 22lr. However, motorcycle helmets are designed primarily to diffuse force, so I suspect protection would be minimal against a projectile. I could put a small water melon inside the helmet for more realistic testing. I'm not quite sure if that would be funny or macabre. :rolleyes:
Well, I KNOW penetration resistance is part of the testing. It's not guaranteed when you're in an accident you will only impact a flat surface. And, yes, after a few year or after even ONE accident, a helmet must be retired.
"Even if the bee could explain to the fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly could never understand."

Re: SHTF...do you really need a helmet?

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YankeeTarheel wrote:
MaxWyatt wrote:
YankeeTarheel wrote:We saw all those alt-right militias in C'ville. Pretend soldiers.

Motorcycle helmets are designed for both impact and penetration protection. Will it stop a .223 round? Probably not, not even the kevlar ones. But the Snell Rating on MC helmets is probably the best indicator of penetration resistance, although, curiously not necessarily the safest helmet for road use--unless your regularly riding include race grade speeds.
I've got an old helmet that needs to be retired. I could do some testing, but it would be limited to 9mm and 22lr. However, motorcycle helmets are designed primarily to diffuse force, so I suspect protection would be minimal against a projectile. I could put a small water melon inside the helmet for more realistic testing. I'm not quite sure if that would be funny or macabre. :rolleyes:
Well, I KNOW penetration resistance is part of the testing. It's not guaranteed when you're in an accident you will only impact a flat surface. And, yes, after a few year or after even ONE accident, a helmet must be retired.
Does that mean I should use the water melon or not? :thumbup:
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Re: SHTF...do you really need a helmet?

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MaxWyatt wrote:
YankeeTarheel wrote:We saw all those alt-right militias in C'ville. Pretend soldiers.

Motorcycle helmets are designed for both impact and penetration protection. Will it stop a .223 round? Probably not, not even the kevlar ones. But the Snell Rating on MC helmets is probably the best indicator of penetration resistance, although, curiously not necessarily the safest helmet for road use--unless your regularly riding include race grade speeds.
I've got an old helmet that needs to be retired. I could do some testing, but it would be limited to 9mm and 22lr. However, motorcycle helmets are designed primarily to diffuse force, so I suspect protection would be minimal against a projectile. I could put a small water melon inside the helmet for more realistic testing. I'm not quite sure if that would be funny or macabre. :rolleyes:
Sounds like funny and macabretastic! You should totally do this experiment and post the results here. For science.
Do you believe in unlikelihoods?

Re: SHTF...do you really need a helmet?

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CottonMcKnight77 wrote:
MaxWyatt wrote:
YankeeTarheel wrote:We saw all those alt-right militias in C'ville. Pretend soldiers.

Motorcycle helmets are designed for both impact and penetration protection. Will it stop a .223 round? Probably not, not even the kevlar ones. But the Snell Rating on MC helmets is probably the best indicator of penetration resistance, although, curiously not necessarily the safest helmet for road use--unless your regularly riding include race grade speeds.
I've got an old helmet that needs to be retired. I could do some testing, but it would be limited to 9mm and 22lr. However, motorcycle helmets are designed primarily to diffuse force, so I suspect protection would be minimal against a projectile. I could put a small water melon inside the helmet for more realistic testing. I'm not quite sure if that would be funny or macabre. :rolleyes:
Sounds like funny and macabretastic! You should totally do this experiment and post the results here. For science.
Don't think a watermelon will fit unless you have a REALLY big head! A honey-dew melon or large cantaloupe might fit better. It's a lot less macabre than a fake head filled with fake blood and brains! Again, not sure the force of 150-200 pound head hitting something rather pointy at 150mph versus a 9mm at 1200 fps hitting it. Something to do with mass * velocity, I think.
"Even if the bee could explain to the fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly could never understand."

Re: SHTF...do you really need a helmet?

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YankeeTarheel wrote:
Don't think a watermelon will fit unless you have a REALLY big head! A honey-dew melon or large cantaloupe might fit better. It's a lot less macabre than a fake head filled with fake blood and brains! Again, not sure the force of 150-200 pound head hitting something rather pointy at 150mph versus a 9mm at 1200 fps hitting it. Something to do with mass * velocity, I think.
Honey dew. Good idea, and much easier to find than a small water melon. This test will be somewhat less than scientifically valid, but the fun factor should more than make up for it. :bananadance:
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Re: SHTF...do you really need a helmet?

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MaxWyatt wrote:
YankeeTarheel wrote:
Don't think a watermelon will fit unless you have a REALLY big head! A honey-dew melon or large cantaloupe might fit better. It's a lot less macabre than a fake head filled with fake blood and brains! Again, not sure the force of 150-200 pound head hitting something rather pointy at 150mph versus a 9mm at 1200 fps hitting it. Something to do with mass * velocity, I think.
Honey dew. Good idea, and much easier to find than a small water melon. This test will be somewhat less than scientifically valid, but the fun factor should more than make up for it. :bananadance:
Be sure to video it! :shoot2:
"Even if the bee could explain to the fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly could never understand."

Re: SHTF...do you really need a helmet?

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JColville wrote:A video suggestion pops up in my YouTube feed with some guy giving his top 5 helmets for your SHTF BoB.
On my second and third tours in Nam I was in recon battalion. We never wore helmets. We did LRRPs (long range reconnaissance patrols that could keep us out for week. Helmets were rejected because the weight to protection ratio made it a no brained.

Re the idiotic advice one can get on YouTube, it means the viewer ought to always check the credentials of the presenter. So many frauds there that much of the advice is bogus.

Re: SHTF...do you really need a helmet?

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IMHO, a military style helmet is a "shoot me first", "let's get that military person to help us", "let's follow that military person" kind of thing. If I lived in a militia compound, it would be OK, but not in civilian area.
Since I am retired, I don't spend much time in tall buildings anymore. So avoiding things falling on my head is not as much of a problem. If i did work in a tall bldg again, I might go for a cheap motorcycle helmet in my desk drawer, but just a plain ol construction worker hard hat seems like the least attention getting head protection.

And now that you've got you fancy helmet, please keep in mind that the ground is covered in nails, screws, and jagged pieces of metal and glass. Do you have full steel shank boots?
All religions united with government are more or less inimical to liberty. All, separated from government, are compatible with liberty.-Henry Clay
Both oligarch and tyrant mistrust the people, and therefore deprive them of their arms.—Aristotle

Re: SHTF...do you really need a helmet?

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I just realized: If your SHTF vehicle is a motorcycle then you DEFINITELY want a helmet, armored boots, shin, knee, elbow and shoulder pads. Kevlar pants (Draggin Jeans) would also be good.

I'm not thinking bullets but all the stuff you may run into.
"Even if the bee could explain to the fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly could never understand."

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