New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

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New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#1 Post by K9s » Wed Mar 20, 2019 11:28 pm

New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks that left 50 dead

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/as ... story.html

CHRISTCHURCH, New Zealand — New Zealand will ban military-style semiautomatics and assault rifles, Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern announced Thursday, just six days after attacks on two mosques in Christchurch that left 50 people dead.

“On 15 March our history changed forever. Now, our laws will, too,” Ardern said. “We are announcing action today on behalf of all New Zealanders to strengthen our gun laws and make our country a safer place.”

She also announced a buyback scheme to encourage people who own such weapons to surrender them.

The admitted gunman who attacked the Al Noor and Linwood mosques here Friday used AR-15 weapons in the worst mass shooting New Zealand has ever seen.

As the country continues to face the aftermath of the unprecedented tragedy, on Wednesday, 16-year-old Hamza Mustafa and his father, Khaled Mustafa, who had arrived in New Zealand only a few months ago after escaping the war in Syria, were laid to rest, becoming the first victims of the Christchurch mosque attacks to be buried.
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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#2 Post by SubRosa » Thu Mar 21, 2019 1:03 am

Bump, bump, bump, another one bites the dust...

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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#3 Post by SubRosa » Thu Mar 21, 2019 1:05 am

Oops, dupe.

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Last edited by SubRosa on Thu Mar 21, 2019 10:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#4 Post by 7N6Wolf » Thu Mar 21, 2019 3:18 am

Once again, the civilian disarmament lobby hasn’t let a good crisis go to waste. This Australian-style confiscation measure will also be upheld as a model over here in the US by those who claim they don’t want to take our guns.


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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#5 Post by dougb » Thu Mar 21, 2019 9:49 am

A policy works for many years, then there is a tragic event, so change the policy with little or no debate or research. The one common characteristic in mass shootings is some used a gun/car/truck/airplane/bomb to kill people. So ban the gun. It shows you are doing something.
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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#6 Post by highdesert » Thu Mar 21, 2019 10:52 am

dougb wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 9:49 am
A policy works for many years, then there is a tragic event, so change the policy with little or no debate or research. The one common characteristic in mass shootings is some used a gun/car/truck/airplane/bomb to kill people. So ban the gun. It shows you are doing something.
If the NZ government does it, it has to be by law so it depends on what the laws says. I agree, a knee jerk reaction and we'll have to see if it passes parliament, the NZ parliament is a single chamber house of representatives. Looks like the immediate ban could be an action of the privy council.
Ardern said a sales ban was effective immediately to prevent stockpiling and would be followed by a complete ban on the weapons after new laws are rushed through.

The ban includes any “military-style” semi-automatic guns or shotguns that are capable of being used with a detachable magazine that holds more than five rounds. It also extends to accessories, such as bump stocks, used to convert guns into what the government called “military-style” weapons.

Military-style semi-automatics have been defined under New Zealand law as rifles with magazines exceeding seven shots, or with pistol grips, folding or telescopic butts, bayonet attachments or flash suppressors at the end of the barrel.

Many different types of firearms, from pistols to rifles and shotguns, can be semi-automatic. Semi-automatic refers to a firearm’s ability to self-load, not only firing a bullet with each trigger pull, but also reloading and making the firearm capable of firing again.
https://www.apnews.com/38e0f6118d0644d1b65baed622670f8a
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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#7 Post by featureless » Thu Mar 21, 2019 11:14 am

New Zealand is free to do what they want. They have no right to bear arms in their founding documents. I don't agree with it, but if their voters support it...

Now the wails and gnashing from the US Dem party of "see, New Zealand can do it!" are a different matter. We have a right to keep and bear arms that the government cannot infringe (yeah, right) upon in our Bill of Rights. Instead of addressing violence as violence, the dems assign the assault rifle boogieman the blame and get all indignant and shit. Time for a bit-o-naval gazing from team D. Comparing apples to oranges is useful so far as determining they are different fruits.

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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#8 Post by sikacz » Thu Mar 21, 2019 11:57 am

featureless wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 11:14 am
New Zealand is free to do what they want. They have no right to bear arms in their founding documents. I don't agree with it, but if their voters support it...

Now the wails and gnashing from the US Dem party of "see, New Zealand can do it!" are a different matter. We have a right to keep and bear arms that the government cannot infringe (yeah, right) upon in our Bill of Rights. Instead of addressing violence as violence, the dems assign the assault rifle boogieman the blame and get all indignant and shit. Time for a bit-o-naval gazing from team D. Comparing apples to oranges is useful so far as determining they are different fruits.
Agreed.
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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#9 Post by TrueTexan » Thu Mar 21, 2019 12:00 pm

NZ doesn't have the second amendment. They also operate under a different set of laws and form of government. Think of them as the UK of the South Pacific
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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#10 Post by danhue » Thu Mar 21, 2019 12:49 pm

I read or heard that the buyback would cost around $200 million. If true, gun ownership must not be a big thing in NZ.

With that said, disarming good people as the tide of fascism is rising does not make sense to me, at least not if you think it through.

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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#11 Post by sikacz » Thu Mar 21, 2019 12:56 pm

TrueTexan wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 12:00 pm
NZ doesn't have the second amendment. They also operate under a different set of laws and form of government. Think of them as the UK of the South Pacific
Pretty much. It’s amazing how our own politicians and people don’t realize constitutions differ among countries. I’m not going to check to verify NZ, but many countries do not recognize the right to self defense with a firearm. In places it invalidates a purchase license to buy or own if it’s stated. I’m always puzzled why the distinction is not noted. Probably because it doesn’t play to their agenda. Fascism is real and comes cloaked in good intentions.
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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#12 Post by Mason » Thu Mar 21, 2019 1:01 pm

There are going to a lot of FN FAL's going under the saw. When the NZ Defense forces changed to the Steyr Aug in the late 80's they sold a huge amount of the FAL's into the civilian market. I remember every inch of wall space in my local gun shop being filled with them standing upright.
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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#13 Post by SubRosa » Thu Mar 21, 2019 1:48 pm

Wishful thinking would be to tear them down, cut the receiver up, and send the rest over here.

I love FALs. :weep:

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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#14 Post by SpaceRanger42 » Thu Mar 21, 2019 2:42 pm

I have been talking to a guy in the UK, it's almost worse over there. They can have ARs and AKs just no gas systems. Even a milsurp garand needs to be sabotaged to manual cocking. And they can't run pistols at all other than black powder revolvers. They give two shits about magazine caps since every civilian rifle has a limited rate of fire. That horrified me a tiny bit.
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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#15 Post by DispositionMatrix » Thu Mar 21, 2019 3:48 pm

Here is what is to come for New Zealand firearm owners.
New Zealand’s swift change to gun laws highlights 25 years of US inaction
In a press conference on Thursday, Ardern promised increased penalties for continued ownership of the banned weapons. New Zealand’s minister of police said police were “gearing up” to enable military-style weapons to be taken out of circulation. Police will be supported by the New Zealand defense force, he said, and would consult gun licensing records.

Ardern promised the country would continue to consider broader gun control measures on Monday, including issues such as licensing, registration and storage.

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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#16 Post by sikacz » Thu Mar 21, 2019 4:23 pm

DispositionMatrix wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 3:48 pm
Here is what is to come for New Zealand firearm owners.
New Zealand’s swift change to gun laws highlights 25 years of US inaction
In a press conference on Thursday, Ardern promised increased penalties for continued ownership of the banned weapons. New Zealand’s minister of police said police were “gearing up” to enable military-style weapons to be taken out of circulation. Police will be supported by the New Zealand defense force, he said, and would consult gun licensing records.

Ardern promised the country would continue to consider broader gun control measures on Monday, including issues such as licensing, registration and storage.
And this is why registration of guns is not going to be acceptable.
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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#17 Post by featureless » Thu Mar 21, 2019 4:34 pm

sikacz wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 4:23 pm
And this is why registration of guns is not going to be acceptable.
Don't be silly. Democrats say nobody is coming for your guns. It's just a little common sense gun control. (that is, until definitions are changed)

I will say, you all have evolved my views on registration from agnostic to fuck that (not that it matters in the registration land of CA). It's funny. If you threaten somebody's rights long and often enough, they start pushing back on your "reasonable" infringements. CA is such a clusterfuck of gun laws I've simply had my fill and I've yet to see that compromise thing.

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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#18 Post by DispositionMatrix » Thu Mar 21, 2019 5:08 pm

A few more details:
Assault rifles to be banned in New Zealand in aftermath of massacre, Prime Minister says
In the interim, New Zealand Governor General Patsy Reddy has signed an order to reclassify some semi-automatic weapons as "military-style".

As a result, many people who legally owned certain firearms will no longer be able to possess them on their existing license conditions.
"I can't emphasize enough that in the current environment it is important you do not take your now-unlawful firearm anywhere without notifying police," Bush said. "It is absolutely vital that we manage the safe and organized transport of all firearms into police custody."
PM Statement on Christchurch mosques terror attack - 21 March
MINISTER OF POLICE HON STUART NASH: Thank you Prime Minister. Two hours ago, I was amongst a group of Ministers who signed off on the order which tightens the law on the sale of assault rifles. It is an interim step until legislation can be introduced and passed to ban all military style semi-automatics. These measures will make a real difference to enable New Zealand to become a safer place.

As the Prime Minister has already said, the time to act is now. The order which is now in effect will discourage the potential stockpiling of these assault rifles and encourage people to continue to surrender their firearms. Dozens of farm-owners have come forward so far and I expect more will do so. Police are gearing up to enable these weapons to be taken out of circulation. They’ll be supported by the New Zealand Defence Force to enable safe storage, transport, and destruction of assault rifles and MSSAs. The Prime Minister has also alluded to – police are definitely encouraging firearms owners to go to the police website and use the online form to arrange to hand over the MSSAs assault rifles. Finally, I want to remind that it is a privilege and not a right to own a firearm in New Zealand. We know that there are many gun owners with legitimate reasons for owning firearms especially in our rural and provincial communities. This work is not directed at them. Our focus is on ensuring the immediate safety and peace of mind of our communities.


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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#20 Post by K9s » Thu Mar 21, 2019 8:54 pm

featureless wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 4:34 pm
sikacz wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 4:23 pm
And this is why registration of guns is not going to be acceptable.
Don't be silly. Democrats say nobody is coming for your guns. It's just a little common sense gun control. (that is, until definitions are changed)

I will say, you all have evolved my views on registration from agnostic to fuck that (not that it matters in the registration land of CA). It's funny. If you threaten somebody's rights long and often enough, they start pushing back on your "reasonable" infringements. CA is such a clusterfuck of gun laws I've simply had my fill and I've yet to see that compromise thing.
Registration is going to be quite an argument between the states and feds in the future. The anti-registration streak feelings in red states run very deep. It doesn't bother me either way. Nothing I can do about it if it happens. I assume that someone somewhere has a pretty good list of who has what in red states.

Unless you have something that is passed down, I bet that not too many people have bought them for cash with no paper trail. Most (like mine) have a paper trail that could be followed regardless of registration. Many have been seen by others or posted on the internet. It wouldn't be too hard for the feds to pass a registration law and just prosecute people for it when they get caught with unregistered weapons. Over decades, the number of unregistered firearms would become insignificant.
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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#21 Post by sikacz » Fri Mar 22, 2019 7:55 am

K9s wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 8:54 pm
featureless wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 4:34 pm
sikacz wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 4:23 pm
And this is why registration of guns is not going to be acceptable.
Don't be silly. Democrats say nobody is coming for your guns. It's just a little common sense gun control. (that is, until definitions are changed)

I will say, you all have evolved my views on registration from agnostic to fuck that (not that it matters in the registration land of CA). It's funny. If you threaten somebody's rights long and often enough, they start pushing back on your "reasonable" infringements. CA is such a clusterfuck of gun laws I've simply had my fill and I've yet to see that compromise thing.
Registration is going to be quite an argument between the states and feds in the future. The anti-registration streak feelings in red states run very deep. It doesn't bother me either way. Nothing I can do about it if it happens. I assume that someone somewhere has a pretty good list of who has what in red states.

Unless you have something that is passed down, I bet that not too many people have bought them for cash with no paper trail. Most (like mine) have a paper trail that could be followed regardless of registration. Many have been seen by others or posted on the internet. It wouldn't be too hard for the feds to pass a registration law and just prosecute people for it when they get caught with unregistered weapons. Over decades, the number of unregistered firearms would become insignificant.
By unofficial records they know all I have too. They have no real idea what I have since private sales can legally be performed in my state with out going through a FFL and NICS check. What this type of action by NZ does is strengthen the position that some gun owners have that private sales should not be required to do background checks and FFL and that registration in any form may lead to confiscation. As it stands today, it’s my say so as to what I still own. I was leaning toward having the NICS records open to the public for private sales. Not so sure, I want to give the restrictionist types a clue.
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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#22 Post by DispositionMatrix » Fri Mar 22, 2019 12:19 pm

The website on which New Zealanders are supposed to arrange to surrender their firearms allegedly was temporarily shut down due to trolling yesterday. Too many phase plasma rifles in the 40-watt range submitted, I guess.
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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#23 Post by DispositionMatrix » Fri Mar 22, 2019 12:23 pm

New Zealand police video.
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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#24 Post by sikacz » Fri Mar 22, 2019 12:37 pm

What we see in NZ and here is the difference between a privilege and a right. A privilege can be revoked instantly a right takes a bit longer.
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Re: New Zealand bans military-style rifles, prime minister says days after mosque attacks

#25 Post by highdesert » Fri Mar 22, 2019 12:59 pm

I agree the difference between a privilege and a right and the British tradition. NZ like Canada, Australia, South Africa...was given self'government by an act of the British Parliament, in the case of Canada it was the British North America Act (BNA) of 1867 which until 1983 was their constitution. If they wanted BNA changed they had to go back to the UK Parliament.
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