Elizabeth Warren 2020

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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#51 Post by featureless » Mon Aug 12, 2019 6:25 pm

^^^ So, eviscerate the 2A. Registered firearms only for those deemed by .gov to be ok. I love being treated like a criminal for exercising my rights. When do we start eviscerating the rest of them?

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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#52 Post by senorgrand » Mon Aug 12, 2019 6:30 pm

See "The Patriot Act"
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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#53 Post by featureless » Mon Aug 12, 2019 6:37 pm

senorgrand wrote:
Mon Aug 12, 2019 6:30 pm
See "The Patriot Act"
Yeah, but that's "patriotic."

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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#54 Post by K9s » Mon Aug 12, 2019 11:38 pm

DispositionMatrix wrote:
Mon Aug 12, 2019 5:28 pm
Protecting Our Communities from Gun Violence
It's basically a ban-all-the-things bullet list encompassing everything championed by disarmament enthusiasts, including the following:
  • Enact UBCs.
  • Impose multiple-purchase reporting.
  • Raise the minimum purchase age.
  • Go after Wells Fargo.
  • End what firearm prohibitionists call the "boyfriend loophole."
  • Ban 3D-printed firearms.
  • Ban 80% receivers.
  • Ban pistol braces.
  • Impose a federal licensing system.
  • Close what firearm prohibitionists call the "Charleston loophole."
  • Impose 30% tax on firearms.
  • Impose 50% tax on ammunition.
  • Restrict firearm purchases to on per month.
  • Ban"assault weapons" by prohibiting new manufacturing and sales and requiring registering existing semi-autos under the NFA, complete with firearm surrender and penalties for non-compliance.
  • Ban standard-capacity mags.
  • Ban suppressors.
  • Ban trigger cranks.
  • Enact ERPOs.
  • Ban anyone convicted of a hate crime from owning a firearm.
  • Expand the GFSZA to cover colleges and to apply to concealed carriers.
  • Repeal the PLCAA.
  • Make firearm manufacturers strictly liable for compensatory damages committed by criminals and make their CEOs criminally liable.
  • Impose regulation of the firearms industry by the Consumer Product Safety Commission.
Not gonna happen.
The border between civilization and savagery is porous and patrolled by opportunists. Resist fascism. Vote like your democracy depends on it.

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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#55 Post by highdesert » Tue Aug 13, 2019 9:35 am

Warren and the rest of the Dems think they found the magic club to beat Trump and Republicans with, AWB and gun control.
As they converged this past weekend in Iowa — a state with a robust gun culture and an affinity for the Republican president — the stinging case for gun control laid out by White House hopefuls had little in common with past appeals for additional regulation and much to do with the implications of Trump’s role in stoking violent white nationalism.
In Iowa, where Trump beat Hillary Clinton by more than 9 percentage points in 2016, the Republican-controlled Legislature this year passed a resolution seeking to add pro-gun language to the state constitution.

Some Democrats in early primary states worry about the risks of pushing the subject too hard. “There’s a pretty heavy gun culture out here in Iowa, even among Democrats,” said Tom Courtney, a former Iowa state senator now co-chairman of the Des Moines County Democrats.

He said it’s “good politics to be talking about the instantaneous background checks and all that.” However, he feared a movement within the Democratic Party to push even further left after the Texas and Ohio shootings, including with a discussion of mandatory buy-back programs, could be harmful to the eventual nominee. In Iowa, he said, “That’s crazy talk.”
https://www.politico.com/story/2019/08/ ... cy-1458135
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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#56 Post by senorgrand » Tue Aug 13, 2019 9:46 am

Dems are stepping over themselves on the issue, while republicans are signalling capitulation. The NRA is in disarray. Not a good time for gun owners.
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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#57 Post by K9s » Tue Aug 13, 2019 12:45 pm

senorgrand wrote:
Tue Aug 13, 2019 9:46 am
Dems are stepping over themselves on the issue, while republicans are signalling capitulation. The NRA is in disarray. Not a good time for gun owners.
I don't think they are capitulating. I think the national GOP is following Trump over a cliff.

The GOP is tied to Trump and only Trump. They are going to focus on socialism and immigration for 2020. If they were to figure out that AWB might work better, I would agree with you. However, they are exhibiting the weaknesses of every autocratic party. An autocrat doesn't make the best decisions, but no one can challenge the autocrat.

States and our right-wing courts will block an AWB this time no matter what happens.
The border between civilization and savagery is porous and patrolled by opportunists. Resist fascism. Vote like your democracy depends on it.

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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#58 Post by featureless » Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:05 pm

K9s wrote:
Tue Aug 13, 2019 12:45 pm
our right-wing courts will block an AWB this time no matter what happens.
As a Californian living under 9th Circuit rule, I have a low level of confidence in this statement. :(

I want to believe, but...

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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#59 Post by senorgrand » Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:22 pm

Also, as Californian gun owners know, the wheels of justice grind slowly.
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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#60 Post by featureless » Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:47 pm

senorgrand wrote:
Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:22 pm
Also, as Californian gun owners know, the wheels of justice grind slowly.
Yup. Successful challenge of an AWB does us no good if we've all expired by the time the case prevails... :coffee:

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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#61 Post by max129 » Tue Aug 13, 2019 2:28 pm

Own a revolver and a lever action rifle as backup.
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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#62 Post by highdesert » Tue Aug 13, 2019 2:47 pm

Nothing yet to counteract the feeding frenzy of gun control, it's August and a lot of people are on vacation or they have disconnected. Some on the right wing are speculating that there are more on the left implicated in Epstein's web than Bill Clinton, they speculate on Hollywood moguls and billionaires like Bloomberg. Epstein's dead but the investigation continues, we hope.
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#63 Post by K9s » Tue Aug 13, 2019 2:57 pm

max129 wrote:
Tue Aug 13, 2019 2:28 pm
Own a revolver and a lever action rifle as backup.
Or two.
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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#64 Post by senorgrand » Tue Aug 13, 2019 3:04 pm

Or four... ;)
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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#65 Post by TrueTexan » Tue Aug 13, 2019 3:08 pm

K9s wrote:
Tue Aug 13, 2019 2:57 pm
max129 wrote:
Tue Aug 13, 2019 2:28 pm
Own a revolver and a lever action rifle as backup.
Or two.
Is that two revolvers and a lever action? Then I'm set twice . S&W 686plus 3 in and 6 inch Henry Big Boy steel all in 357 magnum. Ruger alaskan and Super Redhawk along with Henry Big Boy Brass Alloy in 44 magnum.
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored.-Huxley
The illegal we do immediately; the unconstitutional takes a little longer-Kissinger
Reasoning will never make a Man correct an ill Opinion, which by Reasoning he never acquired.-Swift

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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#66 Post by DispositionMatrix » Fri Aug 16, 2019 3:43 pm


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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#67 Post by senorgrand » Fri Aug 16, 2019 4:05 pm

Summary? I cant watch videos without wifi
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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#68 Post by K9s » Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:33 pm

TrueTexan wrote:
Tue Aug 13, 2019 3:08 pm
K9s wrote:
Tue Aug 13, 2019 2:57 pm
max129 wrote:
Tue Aug 13, 2019 2:28 pm
Own a revolver and a lever action rifle as backup.
Or two.
Is that two revolvers and a lever action? Then I'm set twice . S&W 686plus 3 in and 6 inch Henry Big Boy steel all in 357 magnum. Ruger alaskan and Super Redhawk along with Henry Big Boy Brass Alloy in 44 magnum.
I need another lever gun, I guess. :)
The border between civilization and savagery is porous and patrolled by opportunists. Resist fascism. Vote like your democracy depends on it.

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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#69 Post by VodoundaVinci » Mon Aug 26, 2019 10:33 am

Transcript of the video for senorgrand:

On Thursday Democrat presidential hopeful Elizabeth Warren tweeted a video clip in which she pledged the executive action in every corner for gun control. Warren said 40,000 Americans died last year from gun violence. Warren's claim is actually a loose reference to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention numbers for 2017. The most recent numbers which show 39,773 people died and firearm related death however Warren did not mention that nearly two-thirds of those deaths were due to suicide not gun violence. In fact the surge in the gun deaths was the result of a surge in suicides and the Chicago Tribune Steven Chapman notes that the increase was actually greater for the non firearm suicide rate than for the firearm suicide rate.

But Warren presented that all is due to gun violence before pledging to more gun control which included a promise to reduce the number of gun violence deaths by 80 percent. She said we will make changes until we all figure out what works and then we'll make some more changes.

Warren added I will take executive action in every corner with the Department of Justice with ATF to move as much as I can. She then noted that Congress will have a role too but she suggested they are frozen in place because the gun industry controls Washington. She described such influence as corruption and said real change meaningful change starts with breaking up the corruption in Washington, breaking the NRA awr Hawkins is an award-winning Second Amendment columnist for Breitbart news and the writer / curator of down newsletter focused on all things Second Amendment. Also for Breitbart news he is the political analyst where armed American radio follow him on Twitter.


I took this from an audio transcript - the punctuation is mine.

VooDoo

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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#70 Post by TrueTexan » Mon Aug 26, 2019 11:03 am

This is why I’m looking to buy a Ruger Mini-14 and sell my Yugoslav AKM underfolder.
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored.-Huxley
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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#71 Post by max129 » Mon Aug 26, 2019 11:16 am

TrueTexan said:

This is why I’m looking to buy a Ruger Mini-14 and sell my Yugoslav AKM underfolder.

Yes, there are several schools of thought here:

More regulation is coming so ...

1) Buy a future illegal black rifles and be ready to lose it in a boat accident - also get lots of ammo

2) Assume black rifles will be illegal and buy a benign looking semi-auto with the same function (TrueTexan's plan-of-record)

3) Assume all semi-autos may become illegal (it could happen) and move to lever action rifles

As for handgun magazines, I have already acquired 10-rounds mags for my semi-autos. I cannot, in good conscience, say that I would turn in or destroy any larger capacity mags. I suspect I will not be able to find them in some old box somewhere.
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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#72 Post by highdesert » Mon Aug 26, 2019 11:32 am

Warren added I will take executive action in every corner with the Department of Justice with ATF to move as much as I can.
Another administration run by Executive Orders within a fortress of constant lawsuits. I like Warren but she appeals to a limited number of voters as the CNN poll pointed out and that's not enough to get elected president.
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#73 Post by featureless » Mon Aug 26, 2019 11:45 am

Using an executive order to restrict a constitutional right seems... contrary to their purpose.

Assault weapon buybacks/confiscation is my line in the sand. I really like many of her other proposals. It's unfortunate she's taken this path. She's smart enough to know better.

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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#74 Post by max129 » Mon Aug 26, 2019 11:55 am

highdesert said:

I like Warren but she appeals to a limited number of voters as the CNN poll pointed out ...
I worry about the exact same thing.

Every successful Democratic POTUS in the past 100 years as had "the common touch" sometimes an affectation, but always present. Obama had to get into the mode of "common touch", but he could do it. JFK learned it as a line officer in WWII. FDR had a slightly condescending, parental version of the "common touch", but he made it work, and it suited his times. Al Gore - epic fail. Dukakis - epic fail. ... and so on. Bill Clinton - born a "common man" and used it to his advantage continuously.

My biggest worry about Elizabeth Warren is that she is a non-stop policy wonk that connects poorly on the "common touch" front. All of this is unfair of course, but at the core of democracy is a popularity contest - not the best way to pick a leader, but the best we have.

I personally would have zero problems voting for EW. I think she could do the job.

I worry that she will not engender the excitement that is a prerequisite for a successful Democratic POTUS victory.

Speaking of which, time to donate another $25 to EW to keep her numbers up - as you can see, we have all been trained to "game" the system.
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Re: Elizabeth Warren 2020

#75 Post by K9s » Mon Aug 26, 2019 12:37 pm

featureless wrote:
Mon Aug 26, 2019 11:45 am
Using an executive order to restrict a constitutional right seems... contrary to their purpose.

Assault weapon buybacks/confiscation is my line in the sand. I really like many of her other proposals. It's unfortunate she's taken this path. She's smart enough to know better.
McConnell courts will stop confiscation and it is just a stupid idea at this time. Too many nuts will take it as a sign of the end times or whatever. Buybacks would cost a lot of money that should go to free health clinics and free solar panels for the people.

An AWB (sale and manufacture of new items), import ban, and mag cap are more likely. Honestly, if they let me keep my mags or would replace them with 10 rounders (good luck finding 10 rounders for some old weapons), I would feel better about it. If they banned and confiscated expensive sports cars, yachts, and 10+ bedroom mansions, too, I would also feel better about it. :)
The border between civilization and savagery is porous and patrolled by opportunists. Resist fascism. Vote like your democracy depends on it.

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