We keep F'n up!

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https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/th ... f307969d26
Vietnam and Iraq, of course, were fundamentally irregular, or asymmetric conflicts. Far more than conventional conflicts, irregular wars are shaped more by politics and political organization among the people than by military operations. Since Vietnam, America’s senior foreign policy decision makers have a very unfortunate habit of forgetting this fundamental truth. They have been overly enamored by the power of the U.S. military machine, but obtuse in failing to recognize the limits of military power alone to shape politics in foreign societies.

This tendency goes far in explaining why the United States keeps losing wars.
Nothing is changing and we need to smarten up. That includes our current Ukraine disaster.
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"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

Re: We keep F'n up!

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Reality is that if we spent just 50% of the annual military budget and 50% of the utterly stupid war on drugs giving foreign aid, building infrastructure in the US and where needed world wide, funding and providing universal health care in the US there is a high likelihood that we could avoid stupid wars.

But as long as we are under Citizens United that ain't gonna happen.
To be vintage it must be older than me!
Stories coming to you from Deep South Texas!
The next gun I buy will be the next to last gun I ever buy. PROMISE!

Re: We keep F'n up!

4
sig230 wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 7:53 pm Reality is that if we spent just 50% of the annual military budget and 50% of the utterly stupid war on drugs giving foreign aid, building infrastructure in the US and where needed world wide, funding and providing universal health care in the US there is a high likelihood that we could avoid stupid wars.

But as long as we are under Citizens United that ain't gonna happen.
Not going to argue about that. You’re probably right.
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"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

Re: We keep F'n up!

6
sikacz wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 4:47 pm https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/th ... f307969d26
Vietnam and Iraq, of course, were fundamentally irregular, or asymmetric conflicts. Far more than conventional conflicts, irregular wars are shaped more by politics and political organization among the people than by military operations. Since Vietnam, America’s senior foreign policy decision makers have a very unfortunate habit of forgetting this fundamental truth. They have been overly enamored by the power of the U.S. military machine, but obtuse in failing to recognize the limits of military power alone to shape politics in foreign societies.

This tendency goes far in explaining why the United States keeps losing wars.
Nothing is changing and we need to smarten up. That includes our current Ukraine disaster.
Sure lets be pacifists while terrorists like DARTH Vladimir Putin and othrrs like him wreak havoc on the world.
That'll work out great.
My Name is Ernesto Inigo Juan Montoya and I approve this message.

Re: We keep F'n up!

7
tonguengroover wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 9:24 pm
sikacz wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 4:47 pm https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/th ... f307969d26
Vietnam and Iraq, of course, were fundamentally irregular, or asymmetric conflicts. Far more than conventional conflicts, irregular wars are shaped more by politics and political organization among the people than by military operations. Since Vietnam, America’s senior foreign policy decision makers have a very unfortunate habit of forgetting this fundamental truth. They have been overly enamored by the power of the U.S. military machine, but obtuse in failing to recognize the limits of military power alone to shape politics in foreign societies.

This tendency goes far in explaining why the United States keeps losing wars.
Nothing is changing and we need to smarten up. That includes our current Ukraine disaster.
Sure lets be pacifists while terrorists like DARTH Vladimir Putin and othrrs like him wreak havoc on the world.
That'll work out great.
Pacifism! You don’t know me very well. I just don’t think this was the war to fight or time. When I think a war should be fought, it would be for all the marbles and total annihilation. You wouldn’t like my kind of war.
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"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

Re: We keep F'n up!

8
I don't believe that Ukraine was a mistake, but it's not going to be a quick war and I don't think Americans have been prepared for the financial costs. We're not fighting an ideology like communism, we're fighting Putin the megalomaniac and supporting our European allies who have a lot more to lose in the conflict.
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: We keep F'n up!

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sikacz wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 9:56 pm
tonguengroover wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 9:24 pm
sikacz wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 4:47 pm https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/th ... f307969d26
Vietnam and Iraq, of course, were fundamentally irregular, or asymmetric conflicts. Far more than conventional conflicts, irregular wars are shaped more by politics and political organization among the people than by military operations. Since Vietnam, America’s senior foreign policy decision makers have a very unfortunate habit of forgetting this fundamental truth. They have been overly enamored by the power of the U.S. military machine, but obtuse in failing to recognize the limits of military power alone to shape politics in foreign societies.

This tendency goes far in explaining why the United States keeps losing wars.
Nothing is changing and we need to smarten up. That includes our current Ukraine disaster.
Sure lets be pacifists while terrorists like DARTH Vladimir Putin and othrrs like him wreak havoc on the world.
That'll work out great.
Pacifism! You don’t know me very well. I just don’t think this was the war to fight or time. When I think a war should be fought, it would be for all the marbles and total annihilation. You wouldn’t like my kind of war.
There will be no old style wars like the past.
My Name is Ernesto Inigo Juan Montoya and I approve this message.

Re: We keep F'n up!

10
Well obviously Putin made the mistake in thinking Ukrainians would just roll over and let the Russian “liberators” roll tanks in and take over the capital to run the country more efficiently as a vassal state and buffer zone to Mother Russia.

And Biden/EU made the mistake in thinking Putin would somehow stroke-out the moment Russia was economically shunned for being uncouth.

Now we have an intractable stalemate where most Russians have lost their life savings and most Americans will slowly use up theirs. And Strongmen will continue to lie and claim they have the power to annihilate so-called enemies if they become leaders, make the Motherland great again, and life all hunky-dory with a chicken in every pot.

I point back to the title of this thread. There is a serious lack of imagination and learning in keeping up this zero-sum game of war. The failure of asymmetrical warfare to bring systemic changes to any country (much less solve the problems within the powerful aggressor) should be the indicator of a faulty premise in the minds of leaders... Wars simply do not solve any problems.

And yet war seemingly is the only solution available to people who suffer traumatic events that cannot be processed or otherwise mollified through behavioral therapy. War is kind of like a kid who sets his bedroom on fire for fear of the monster that may be hiding in the closet.

What Biden and the EU leaders did to stand up to Putin’s aggression on Ukraine with sanctions was not wrong but it is just one step away from opening fire with weapons on Russians. But they did not take steps to ensure Russian people were not feeling targeted by the sanctions. Because quite frankly the West felt outraged and did have a punitive mentality that it could not hide. And so Putin spun the lie that the West was the aggressor, trying to force the Russian people into submission just like in the Cold War. And it’s deja vous all over again...

It takes an enlightened leader not to respond to violence with violence. It takes a skilled parent to know when and how to treat children who are dangerous to themselves and the rest of the household. Because the old world mentality of genocide as the solution to difficult problems has never worked. And warfare mentality certainly doesn’t play well in our age of All Eyes On You and the WWW.

I believe we are on the cusp of discovering a new way of Being. Because all the problems humanity faces from climate change to dwindling resources to mass migrations are all pointing to stressors that lead to warfare (zero-sum mentality) OR human evolution as a species intent on survival through creative, collective, and real solutions to all these challenges.
"It is better to be violent, if there is violence in our hearts, than to put on the cloak of non-violence to cover impotence. There is hope for a violent man to become non-violent. There is no such hope for the impotent." -Gandhi

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