4 year old with loaded gun

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Here's another reason for safe storage practices.
When officers knocked on the family's apartment door, the child answered, police said. Osborne reportedly told police he was ill and had not realized his son had left the apartment, according to the police report. He "advised there was not a firearm in the home, nor did [his son] have any toy guns," and later added that he had no guns due to a past felony conviction, according to the report.

--snrp--

The officers returned to the apartment to conduct another search, during which Osborne reportedly told police that he does not have a firearm, but that a relative may have left one in the apartment, according to the police report. When an officer asked the child where he put his "pew pew," the boy led them to a roll-top desk that contained the handgun, according to the report.

Osborne "did not know the weapon was in the apartment at this time, nor that [his son] knew where it was," according to the report.

The officers returned to the apartment to conduct another search, during which Osborne reportedly told police that he does not have a firearm, but that a relative may have left one in the apartment, according to the police report. When an officer asked the child where he put his "pew pew," the boy led them to a roll-top desk that contained the handgun, according to the report.

Osborne "did not know the weapon was in the apartment at this time, nor that [his son] knew where it was," according to the report.
https://abcnews.go.com/US/dad-arrested- ... d=96484306

The gun apparently had a full magazine but no round was chambered. Osborne was prohibited from gun ownership. No word in the article about the other irresponsible adult, the "relative."

Video at the link.

Stuff like this fuels the righteous anger of the anti 2A crowd, which could result in laws stronger than necessary. I believe it is up to clubs like ours to steer laws and policies in the proper direction, towards safe storage rather than to gun bans--that's where it will go if anti 2A folks have their way. We have a choice. Now, anyway.

CDFingers
Crazy cat peekin' through a lace bandana
like a one-eyed Cheshire, like a diamond-eyed Jack

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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These incidents of improperly secured firearms where kids get them are just too numerous, each for its own thread. Maybe for a short time I'll just pile them up on this thread.
Police were called to a report of a shooting at an apartment complex in south Dallas on Sunday afternoon at about 2 p.m. As part of the investigation, police determined a fight was going on between two girls in the parking lot of the complex.

“One juvenile suspect retrieved a handgun and shot in the direction of the female she was fighting; however, the shot struck a male juvenile bystander,” police said in a statement.

The 11-year-old boy was transported to the hospital where he died from his injuries, police said.

The suspect initially ran from the location but was later taken into custody and charged, and she remains at the Henry Wade Juvenile Justice Center, police said. A weapon was recovered during the investigation, the agency added.
https://www.cnn.com/2023/01/17/us/teen- ... index.html

CDFingers
Crazy cat peekin' through a lace bandana
like a one-eyed Cheshire, like a diamond-eyed Jack

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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So the legal a$$hole in me wants to point out that after Bruen, states shouldn’t be able to mandate safe storage laws - there is definitely no “history and tradition” of regulating the storage of firearms in your home. The rest of me (which thankfully is a still far larger part) wants to personally strangle idiot parents/ etc. like these. Only a total moron keeps a firearm where some small child can get to it. And my contrary legal brain (yes it’s pretty crowded in there) wants to point out that states can still bust these morons using child protection laws/ proceedings. There really isn’t a whole lot that’s a more clear cut example of felonious child endangerment (not to mention a danger to everyone else). So let them burn. I have absolutely no sympathy for these idiots. Life is too short already.

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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Cherry on top - he wasn't allowed to own a gun due to his past criminality. Hope he gets some good jail time and loses custody of the child for the child's safety cause he is apparently too stupid to be a parent.
"Being Republican is more than a difference of opinion - it's a character flaw." "COVID can fix STUPID!"
The greatest, most aggrieved mistake EVER made in USA was electing DJT as POTUS.

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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Here is PBS in a fairly even treatment of the problem of unsecured guns. They respond better than the standard liberal sites like salon and the like.



Even the Violence Policy Center (Josh Sugarmann) advocated for safe storage before their standard anti gun rants. Also, VPC makes the comparison with tobacco and firearms in marketing to kids.

CDFingers
Crazy cat peekin' through a lace bandana
like a one-eyed Cheshire, like a diamond-eyed Jack

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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I agree with Mikeinmich, this is a clear case of child endangerment. Whether the father is a single parent or his wife or girl friend was out, he was responsible for supervising the child. The anti-gunners just eat this stuff up and ABC News put that on their Nightly News out of NYC. That is a suburb of Indianapolis and the article said child protective services were notified.
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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CDFingers wrote: Wed Jan 18, 2023 8:55 am Here's another reason for safe storage practices.
When officers knocked on the family's apartment door, the child answered, police said. Osborne reportedly told police he was ill and had not realized his son had left the apartment, according to the police report. He "advised there was not a firearm in the home, nor did [his son] have any toy guns," and later added that he had no guns due to a past felony conviction, according to the report.

--snrp--

The officers returned to the apartment to conduct another search, during which Osborne reportedly told police that he does not have a firearm, but that a relative may have left one in the apartment, according to the police report. When an officer asked the child where he put his "pew pew," the boy led them to a roll-top desk that contained the handgun, according to the report.

Osborne "did not know the weapon was in the apartment at this time, nor that [his son] knew where it was," according to the report.

The officers returned to the apartment to conduct another search, during which Osborne reportedly told police that he does not have a firearm, but that a relative may have left one in the apartment, according to the police report. When an officer asked the child where he put his "pew pew," the boy led them to a roll-top desk that contained the handgun, according to the report.

Osborne "did not know the weapon was in the apartment at this time, nor that [his son] knew where it was," according to the report.
https://abcnews.go.com/US/dad-arrested- ... d=96484306

The gun apparently had a full magazine but no round was chambered. Osborne was prohibited from gun ownership. No word in the article about the other irresponsible adult, the "relative."

Video at the link.
Stuff like this fuels the righteous anger of the anti 2A crowd, which could result in laws stronger than necessary. I believe it is up to clubs like ours to steer laws and policies in the proper direction, towards safe storage rather than to gun bans--that's where it will go if anti 2A folks have their way. We have a choice. Now, anyway.
CDFingers
Absolutely agree..People that legally own firearms "shoot themselves in the foot" almost daily. Stupid people with(legal) guns..If the gun owners don't steer this ship, the 'antis' will. It's not enough to spout the NRA mantra, gun owners need to get ahead of this or else. Any casual YT search shows LOTS of stupid people with their legally obtained guns.

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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These times of stupid people owning guns aren't the first that caused anti-gun laws to be passed. Back in the days of the "Wild West" during the heyday of the cattle drives, Fort Worth, TX passed one of the first laws requiring people entering the city limit to check their guns at the City Marshall's office while in town. This spread to other towns, Dodge City and Abilene, Kansas also Tombstone, Arizona to name some of the better known Cowtowns. The shootout at the OK Corral was basically an excuse brought about because the Clanton Brothers would not check their guns.
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored.-Huxley
"We can have democracy in this country, or we can have great wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both." ~ Louis Brandeis,

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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TrueTexan wrote: Fri Jan 20, 2023 11:38 am These times of stupid people owning guns aren't the first that caused anti-gun laws to be passed. Back in the days of the "Wild West" during the heyday of the cattle drives, Fort Worth, TX passed one of the first laws requiring people entering the city limit to check their guns at the City Marshall's office while in town. This spread to other towns, Dodge City and Abilene, Kansas also Tombstone, Arizona to name some of the better known Cowtowns. The shootout at the OK Corral was basically an excuse brought about because the Clanton Brothers would not check their guns.
Dom't forget Big Whiskey.

https://www.mansionglobal.com/articles/ ... 1666696733
Getting old, or is it just me?

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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CowboyT wrote: Fri Jan 20, 2023 3:14 pm Again, why aren't the parents mentioned above, and other parents today, raising their children to have respect for firearms, as my Dad raised me to do?
Because they are an ignorant, narrow minded, 'muh guns, non of yer bizness' bunch. They have no respect or sense of responsibility for their legally obtained firearms so their kids don't either.

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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Gun owners need voluntarily to accept responsibility for gun ownership. Unless we're carrying it, fondling it, or can see directly where it is stashed, our guns should be secured. That's responsible gun ownership.

Because no rights are infringed and no liberties are limited, there is no logical reason to avoid being a responsible American gun owner.

CDFingers
Crazy cat peekin' through a lace bandana
like a one-eyed Cheshire, like a diamond-eyed Jack

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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F4FEver wrote: Sat Jan 21, 2023 8:58 am
CowboyT wrote: Fri Jan 20, 2023 3:14 pm Again, why aren't the parents mentioned above, and other parents today, raising their children to have respect for firearms, as my Dad raised me to do?
Because they are an ignorant, narrow minded, 'muh guns, non of yer bizness' bunch. They have no respect or sense of responsibility for their legally obtained firearms so their kids don't either.
In many cases you have it the nail on the head. There are those that firmly believe they have the right to do as they want in raising their children with no respect for others or of the consequences. I'm sure they think it is cute for their kids to play with the real guns. Unfortunately, here in Texas there is a lot of, "Here Kid, hold my Beer and watch this. But don't you drink all my beer."

I'm not kidding. Wife and I were driving down a state highway, near Abilene, to visit friends when we passed a driveway and on the fence was a plywood sign of the Confederate Battle Flag and under it said "Forget Hell". Our friends were thinking about putting an arch gate over the driveway and he said he was thinking what to put on the gate. I said why not a Rainbow. He looked at me and said if he did there would be a group in white sheets visiting his property that very night. This is in rural west Texas the same feels are even worse in east Texas.
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored.-Huxley
"We can have democracy in this country, or we can have great wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both." ~ Louis Brandeis,

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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CDFingers wrote: Sat Jan 21, 2023 9:23 am Gun owners need voluntarily to accept responsibility for gun ownership. Unless we're carrying it, fondling it, or can see directly where it is stashed, our guns should be secured. That's responsible gun ownership.

Because no rights are infringed and no liberties are limited, there is no logical reason to avoid being a responsible American gun owner.

CDFingers
Yet...Be stupid with a gun and then make a video of it...Went to a range...gent next to me thought nothing of walking 'behind' me and reloading their revolver while their buddy blasted away....I am SURE he wouldn't mind me saying that that was not a good idea... :sarcasm:

He even got testy when the mostly missing 'RSO' mentioned this..The 'RSO' watches the firing line via a camera, not actually there..won't be going back there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7TwsWMJbpfk

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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CDFingers wrote: Sun Jan 22, 2023 9:54 am We can't legislate away stupid, but we can try to educate it. A calm word about an unsafe behavior would not be wasted.

CDFingers
But CD, are you saying there should be some sort of 'test' to check gun safety knowledge to perhaps 'test' knowledge of responsible gun ownership?

Sorry to be sarcastic but as long as all you 'need' to buy a gun is a clean record(and not always that-private sales), a driver's license(and not always that) and a credit card/$, there are going to be irresponsible or ignorant, or both, people who buy guns.
People buying guns are in three groups.
Responsible, educated gun owners.
Brand new people who buy a gun(and some are like above).
Fanatic gun weirdos who will yell when anybody says anything about buying a gun that isn't 'muh gun, fuck you'.
I bought a gun at a great LGS(now gone), and when I was checking out with the owner, all I said was. 'great that the BGC only took about 15 minutes'..then got a rather heated tirade about 'gun laws' and how they should all go away. So.......
People who own guns had better get ahead of this, education and responsibility wise or the bloomies of the world will do it for us.

Way WAY too many legal gun owners doing stupid things with their guns. As an individual, I can only do so much, like 'mention' to that guy at the outdoor, uncontrolled range it's probably a 'bad' idea to have a 6 pack of Miller there while you are shooting yer gun but.......(true story)....

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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My point was that at the range if you see an unsafe behavior, you go over after the fact and calmly educate the person about that behavior. "Come over to my table and check this out."

Back in the day it was our dads usually who did that because they took us out to the woods or the fields or the desert and let us shoot guns. Nowadays it's different. I think being a responsible gun owner includes being able calmly to educate younger or less safe gun owners about proper gun handling techniques.

CDFingers
Crazy cat peekin' through a lace bandana
like a one-eyed Cheshire, like a diamond-eyed Jack

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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CDFingers wrote: Mon Jan 23, 2023 9:52 am My point was that at the range if you see an unsafe behavior, you go over after the fact and calmly educate the person about that behavior. "Come over to my table and check this out."

Back in the day it was our dads usually who did that because they took us out to the woods or the fields or the desert and let us shoot guns. Nowadays it's different. I think being a responsible gun owner includes being able calmly to educate younger or less safe gun owners about proper gun handling techniques.

CDFingers
Ideally, yes but I've seen too many arguments(and a couple of times the shooter getting thrown out by the RSO) to think I'm gonna approach any of these yahoos. I have mentioned it to the RSO, but too many times that results in a whole bunch of nuthin'.....Yup, pretty cynical but pretty frequently seen also.

Guy moved the table behind him. Has a timer on his belt...practicing his draw then 6-8-9 rounds as quick as he can...RSO says no rapid fire...guy gets pissed, packs his stuff up and leaves in a huff...not gonna say anything to that 'heavily armed' dude.

I and my sons shoot a lot. We are lucky to have the $ for ammo, so we frequent an uncontrolled outdoor range(since closed) and a couple of indoor ranges and most of the time there is 'somebody' scetchy there. Either newbies who know NOTHING and then won't take offered help, or range ninjas, all tacticool who don't take criticism well or just people doing dumb things..like sweeping his buddy(and me) with his gun....

BUT, all I can do is not be 'that guy' and say something to the RSO....

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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F4FEver wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 8:41 am
CDFingers wrote: Mon Jan 23, 2023 9:52 am My point was that at the range if you see an unsafe behavior, you go over after the fact and calmly educate the person about that behavior. "Come over to my table and check this out."

Back in the day it was our dads usually who did that because they took us out to the woods or the fields or the desert and let us shoot guns. Nowadays it's different. I think being a responsible gun owner includes being able calmly to educate younger or less safe gun owners about proper gun handling techniques.

CDFingers
Ideally, yes but I've seen too many arguments(and a couple of times the shooter getting thrown out by the RSO) to think I'm gonna approach any of these yahoos. I have mentioned it to the RSO, but too many times that results in a whole bunch of nuthin'.....Yup, pretty cynical but pretty frequently seen also.

Guy moved the table behind him. Has a timer on his belt...practicing his draw then 6-8-9 rounds as quick as he can...RSO says no rapid fire...guy gets pissed, packs his stuff up and leaves in a huff...not gonna say anything to that 'heavily armed' dude.

I and my sons shoot a lot. We are lucky to have the $ for ammo, so we frequent an uncontrolled outdoor range(since closed) and a couple of indoor ranges and most of the time there is 'somebody' scetchy there. Either newbies who know NOTHING and then won't take offered help, or range ninjas, all tacticool who don't take criticism well or just people doing dumb things..like sweeping his buddy(and me) with his gun....

BUT, all I can do is not be 'that guy' and say something to the RSO....
I would say that you can't shoot accurately quickly until you can shoot accurately slowly. Let's do some slow shoot drills, one round at a time and concentrate on technique. When and if I get hassled, I say, "I'm somebody's dad. I can't help it."

CDFingers
Crazy cat peekin' through a lace bandana
like a one-eyed Cheshire, like a diamond-eyed Jack

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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CDFingers wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 10:06 am
F4FEver wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 8:41 am
CDFingers wrote: Mon Jan 23, 2023 9:52 am My point was that at the range if you see an unsafe behavior, you go over after the fact and calmly educate the person about that behavior. "Come over to my table and check this out."

Back in the day it was our dads usually who did that because they took us out to the woods or the fields or the desert and let us shoot guns. Nowadays it's different. I think being a responsible gun owner includes being able calmly to educate younger or less safe gun owners about proper gun handling techniques.

CDFingers
Ideally, yes but I've seen too many arguments(and a couple of times the shooter getting thrown out by the RSO) to think I'm gonna approach any of these yahoos. I have mentioned it to the RSO, but too many times that results in a whole bunch of nuthin'.....Yup, pretty cynical but pretty frequently seen also.

Guy moved the table behind him. Has a timer on his belt...practicing his draw then 6-8-9 rounds as quick as he can...RSO says no rapid fire...guy gets pissed, packs his stuff up and leaves in a huff...not gonna say anything to that 'heavily armed' dude.

I and my sons shoot a lot. We are lucky to have the $ for ammo, so we frequent an uncontrolled outdoor range(since closed) and a couple of indoor ranges and most of the time there is 'somebody' scetchy there. Either newbies who know NOTHING and then won't take offered help, or range ninjas, all tacticool who don't take criticism well or just people doing dumb things..like sweeping his buddy(and me) with his gun....

BUT, all I can do is not be 'that guy' and say something to the RSO....
I would say that you can't shoot accurately quickly until you can shoot accurately slowly. Let's do some slow shoot drills, one round at a time and concentrate on technique. When and if I get hassled, I say, "I'm somebody's dad. I can't help it."

CDFingers

And you were a teacher for many years, you have patience which is a great asset when teaching shooting.
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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CDFingers wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 12:51 pm I never thought about that--it's like wearing socks. I don't think about it, but you're right. Thanks for letting me see that.

CDFingers
The way you converse here also reflects your teaching background. LoL. That’s a good thing. I agree that an invitation and some effort at teaching in a friendly way is a better approach.
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"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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Here's another. A fourth grader with a gun. Safe storage issue. No one was injured, which is great.
FREMONT, Neb. (WOWT) - Fremont Police are investigating after a loaded handgun was found in a fourth-grader’s backpack Thursday morning.

“Thank you to the teacher that reported this incident,” said Dr. Brad Dahl, Associate Superintendent of Fremont Public Schools, in a news release from the district. “The protocol we have in place worked. A staff member noticed something out of the ordinary with several students gathered around and intervened immediately. The Fremont Police were called, responded and began their investigation.”

Both the police and the school district confirmed that no staff or students had been threatened or harmed in the incident. The district noted in its news release that the initial investigation indicated the student had brought the gun to school “to show others.”

According to a news release from FPD, officers were called at 8:19 a.m. to Milliken Park Elementary in northwest Fremont to investigate a report from a teacher that a student had brought a gun to school.
https://www.1011now.com/2023/01/26/frem ... un-school/

Most times laws get made after the fact. We should not need to make safe storage laws, but here we are.

CDFingers
Crazy cat peekin' through a lace bandana
like a one-eyed Cheshire, like a diamond-eyed Jack

Re: 4 year old with loaded gun

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Another,and again, luckily no injuries.
HOMESTEAD, Fla. – A South Florida father is facing a felony charge after his 6-year-old daughter brought a gun to school.

According to Homestead police, officers responded to the Keys Gate Charter School, located at 2000 SE 28th Ave. after administrators were alerted about a student who was found with a gun.

Police said it was a Kindergarten student and that the firearm was found in the child’s backpack.

Investigators determined the father of the child, 39-year-old Reginald McCoy, put the gun in the backpack and forgot it was in there when the student was brought to school, police said.
https://www.local10.com/news/local/2023 ... D=ref_fark

CDFingers
Crazy cat peekin' through a lace bandana
like a one-eyed Cheshire, like a diamond-eyed Jack

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