Tell me about race guns...

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NegativeApproach
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Tell me about race guns...

#1 Post by NegativeApproach » Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:52 pm

I'm looking to get into 3 gun, and want something for a red dot. I've got a G19 and a Canik, and am leaning towards a G17 with mount or the TP9SFX as my first foray into something of that nature.

Have mags for both of those, so since I'd need a few, I figured that was the way to go.

Are there any other 3 gun pistol recommendations or other race gun recommendations in general? Anything a total 3 gun noob should consider?

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Re: Tell me about race guns...

#2 Post by atxgunguy » Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:04 pm

Generally speaking, the longer the barrel...the better. If you're going with Glock, just go straight to the G34 MOS. I know a lot of 3-gunners who swear by the TP9SFX and I'm in the market right now for one myself. The Canik is definitely going to be the cheapest entry-level competition 9mm with an RMR.

Classic Firearms has a whole range-ready package right now.

https://classicfirearms.com/century-tp9 ... -hg3774gvn
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Re: Tell me about race guns...

#3 Post by NegativeApproach » Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:29 pm

atxgunguy wrote:
Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:04 pm
Generally speaking, the longer the barrel...the better. If you're going with Glock, just go straight to the G34 MOS. I know a lot of 3-gunners who swear by the TP9SFX and I'm in the market right now for one myself. The Canik is definitely going to be the cheapest entry-level competition 9mm with an RMR.

Classic Firearms has a whole range-ready package right now.

https://classicfirearms.com/century-tp9 ... -hg3774gvn
If I didn't already have a Vortex Viper, I'd definitely consider going that route... I also have a Burris Fastfire, so I really just need the gun (and maybe a compensator).

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Re: Tell me about race guns...

#4 Post by Marlene » Tue Jul 10, 2018 6:29 pm

3 gun isn’t idpa. Sure, the pros run comps n stuff, but you’d be better served by putting the dot sight on a gun you have and spending the money on shooting more and entering more matches.
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Re: Tell me about race guns...

#5 Post by spara » Wed Jul 11, 2018 12:12 am

NegativeApproach wrote:
Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:29 pm
atxgunguy wrote:
Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:04 pm
Generally speaking, the longer the barrel...the better. If you're going with Glock, just go straight to the G34 MOS. I know a lot of 3-gunners who swear by the TP9SFX and I'm in the market right now for one myself. The Canik is definitely going to be the cheapest entry-level competition 9mm with an RMR.

Classic Firearms has a whole range-ready package right now.

https://classicfirearms.com/century-tp9 ... -hg3774gvn
If I didn't already have a Vortex Viper, I'd definitely consider going that route... I also have a Burris Fastfire, so I really just need the gun (and maybe a compensator).
The TP9SFX without the optic comes with 4 base plates so you can use your existing red dot with it. I've been running one in USPSA Carry Optics division this year and it's a pretty nice gun for the money. It's a decent competition gun but I wouldn't call it a race gun by any stretch of the imagination (optic is slide mounted vs frame mounted). The trigger pull is a bit long, but the break is crisp for a striker fired pistol and the reset is short. Grip angle is good, a natural pointer but the factory stippling isn't great for sweaty hands. Runs reliably on cheap 115 grn, most 124 grn, and it's a crap shoot with 147 grn ammo.

I've put in a lighter striker spring, grip tape and a Leupold Delta Point Pro. I've played around with different recoil springs, but it was unreliable so I'm using the factory captured spring. Just added a magwell because I also shoot it in 3gun in the UML 2x4 division. Here's mine, kinda looks like a slicked up Hi-Point :lol: but definitely a shooter.

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Re: Tell me about race guns...

#6 Post by NegativeApproach » Wed Jul 11, 2018 12:12 pm

Marlene wrote:
Tue Jul 10, 2018 6:29 pm
3 gun isn’t idpa. Sure, the pros run comps n stuff, but you’d be better served by putting the dot sight on a gun you have and spending the money on shooting more and entering more matches.
Great advice... thanks!

I may jump into idpa at some point, but I'm still a more casual shooter by most accounts.

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Re: Tell me about race guns...

#7 Post by NegativeApproach » Wed Jul 11, 2018 12:14 pm

spara wrote:
Wed Jul 11, 2018 12:12 am
NegativeApproach wrote:
Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:29 pm
atxgunguy wrote:
Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:04 pm
Generally speaking, the longer the barrel...the better. If you're going with Glock, just go straight to the G34 MOS. I know a lot of 3-gunners who swear by the TP9SFX and I'm in the market right now for one myself. The Canik is definitely going to be the cheapest entry-level competition 9mm with an RMR.

Classic Firearms has a whole range-ready package right now.

https://classicfirearms.com/century-tp9 ... -hg3774gvn
If I didn't already have a Vortex Viper, I'd definitely consider going that route... I also have a Burris Fastfire, so I really just need the gun (and maybe a compensator).
The TP9SFX without the optic comes with 4 base plates so you can use your existing red dot with it. I've been running one in USPSA Carry Optics division this year and it's a pretty nice gun for the money. It's a decent competition gun but I wouldn't call it a race gun by any stretch of the imagination (optic is slide mounted vs frame mounted). The trigger pull is a bit long, but the break is crisp for a striker fired pistol and the reset is short. Grip angle is good, a natural pointer but the factory stippling isn't great for sweaty hands. Runs reliably on cheap 115 grn, most 124 grn, and it's a crap shoot with 147 grn ammo.

I've put in a lighter striker spring, grip tape and a Leupold Delta Point Pro. I've played around with different recoil springs, but it was unreliable so I'm using the factory captured spring. Just added a magwell because I also shoot it in 3gun in the UML 2x4 division. Here's mine, kinda looks like a slicked up Hi-Point :lol: but definitely a shooter.

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I have several caniks, so the fact that I can share mags is a big benefit for me.

I think that's probably the direction I'll go first. I'm not looking to break the bank before I even know if I'll like that style of shooting. I'm assuming I will, but you never know.

I'm surprised to hear that it's finicky with 147gr. My tp9 v2 handles 147 and 150gr HSTs very well.

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Re: Tell me about race guns...

#8 Post by atxgunguy » Wed Jul 11, 2018 12:42 pm

To Sparta's points. The TP9SFX is hardly a, "race gun", but you'll learn the fundamentals without breaking the bank.

It's like buying a Miata to learn to how to drive on a race track. Most people can't (and shouldn't) start with a Porsche GT3RS...likewise, starting with a $3000 STI race gun is not an economical way to figure out if you like competitive shooting or not.
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Re: Tell me about race guns...

#9 Post by Eris » Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:36 pm

grumble grumble

Now you have me looking at 1911's because I *need* one for bullseye shooting.
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Re: Tell me about race guns...

#10 Post by spara » Thu Jul 12, 2018 11:11 am

NegativeApproach wrote:
Wed Jul 11, 2018 12:14 pm
I have several caniks, so the fact that I can share mags is a big benefit for me.

I think that's probably the direction I'll go first. I'm not looking to break the bank before I even know if I'll like that style of shooting. I'm assuming I will, but you never know.

I'm surprised to hear that it's finicky with 147gr. My tp9 v2 handles 147 and 150gr HSTs very well.
I'm not sure why the TP9SFX is so finicky with heavier bullets, I don't have that problem with my TP9SA. I suspect that it's the recoil spring which is quite stiff. I was working on weak hand only shooting this week and I usually don't limp wrist but I had several stovepipes, maybe it's a combination of a stiffer recoil spring and a heavier/longer slide.

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Re: Tell me about race guns...

#11 Post by atxgunguy » Sat Jul 14, 2018 3:07 pm

All this talk had me in a gun store today buying a TP9SFx. :whistle:

@Sparta: What make/model of holster rig are you using with/without the RMR?
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Re: Tell me about race guns...

#12 Post by spara » Sun Jul 15, 2018 7:41 am

atxgunguy wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 3:07 pm
All this talk had me in a gun store today buying a TP9SFx. :whistle:

@Sparta: What make/model of holster rig are you using with/without the RMR?
I use a Red Hill Tactical holster with a B.O.S.S. hanger. This link should give you a 10% discount at Red Hill Tactical https://www.redhilltactical.com/?ref=USPSA and the Ben Stoeger Pro Shop is local to you and you can ask to pick up at their shop.

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Re: Tell me about race guns...

#13 Post by atxgunguy » Tue Jul 17, 2018 11:27 am

Thanks for the holster info!

Is there a reason you went with a Deltapoint over say, the Vortex Viper or Burris Fastfire 3?
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Re: Tell me about race guns...

#14 Post by spara » Tue Jul 17, 2018 6:17 pm

atxgunguy wrote:
Tue Jul 17, 2018 11:27 am
Thanks for the holster info!

Is there a reason you went with a Deltapoint over say, the Vortex Viper or Burris Fastfire 3?
Personal preference because I use the TP9SFX for USPSA and 3gun. It has a wide field of view and 7.5 MOA triangle which makes for quick target acquisition for everything within 15 yards and I can use the tip or bottom of the triangle for accurate shots out past 25 yards depending on the ammunition. Elevation and windage adjustments have nice positive clicks, battery can be replaced without removing it from the gun, and it has instant-on when you draw. I also found it on ebay for little more than similar vortex red dots at retail price.

The one downside is that it sits a bit higher than a vortex and the grip angle of the gun is such that you need to adjust your grip to push the front barrel down a bit, which is different when you've been shooting guns with 1911 grip angles where you grip it in a more neutral position. It also has the option to add an iron rear sight, but the height of the optic requires that you need a suppressor height front sight (which Canik just released as a set).

I shot it for a while with a vortex venom but I didn't like it as much the C-Mores I use on other competition guns which prompted me to look at alternatives.

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Re: Tell me about race guns...

#15 Post by eelj » Tue Jul 17, 2018 9:58 pm

What I recall a race gun is an obscenely expensive 1911 with compensators and aimpoint sights in 38 super, and Jeff Cooper hated them. It's been a long time since I followed the sport.

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Re: Tell me about race guns...

#16 Post by atxgunguy » Wed Jul 18, 2018 6:24 pm

I'm not even close to approaching or justifying the cost of an STI 2011. As I mentioned, my local gun shop is a retailer for them (STI is pretty much in my backyard).

Occasionally they have manufacturer overruns...that still run well over $1500.

Right Now, I figure a $600 gun with tons of ammo is going to be a better investment.
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